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Originally Posted by AnthonyB
Hijolly,
It is the lack of "transcendentalness" in LDS expression that does get me perplexed.
LDS are so concerned in hammering home the manifest that it seems to leave God as a mere "super" man.
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I hope you don't mind me being this blunt, but I would NEVER describe God as a "mere" ANYTHING.
He fills me to overflowing with Fire, with Love, with Joy. I'll grant each of these is an aspect of His transcendent Self and Oneness, but hey, that's why I'm a mystic, after all.
But I'm also a Mormon, and each of these great experiences has occurred within an LDS context. So, I'm both. And VERY happy. As the mysteries begin to unfold before me, I start to see how they all fit together. I have to unlearn some things, but ultimately everything I have learned simply strengthens and supports the LDS Church and its mission. I can't express how happy I am about that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnthonyB
I believe in a God, who has revealed that He is always with me, that there is no where I could go to escape Him. A God who knows my innermost thoughts and hearts intentions better then I know them myself. A God who is the ultimate expression of infinite love, mercy, goodness, kindness. God is my "childhood" hero, my perfect examplar. I strive to be hopefully ever more like Him knowing that an eternity of trying would only be the beginning of the journey.
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I know how you feel. Except 'eternity' is an awfully big word, ya know? Almost as big as God.
Doctrine and Covenants 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnthonyB
Somehow having Him live on a planet near a star called Kolob, with a real body and as a man who managed to work his way to Godhood leaves Him sounding (to me) as much less divine. I don't comprehend that the things in above paragraph which I hold dear about God would be compatable with the LDS vision of God.
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I do. It is helpful, I think, to keep separate stuff LDS leaders have said, and what the LDS Church accepts as doctrine. Please carefully read this:
Approaching Mormon Doctrine - LDS Newsroom I don't typically worry a lot about stuff that isn't doctrine and doesn't make sense. There's far too much other stuff that is really, really awesome. The exception would be when enemies of the Church attack by using these things as a weapon. Say, the Adam-God teachings of Brigham Young. I did worry about that, but only because somebody thought it was a problem. It isn't, but I spent about 20 years figuring that out. But that's not my typical approach -- usually I just move on when I see something that doesn't make sense.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnthonyB
Of course the answer would be Jesus, who was fully God and fully man. However LDS don't appear to have a dual nature Christology and the idea of the limiting/masking divine nature by assuming manhood. Your Father God is permanently incarnate and simultaneously unlimitedly divine.
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Oh sure we do. It's just not DOCTRINE. Heh. Interesting, isn't it? I love it. Think of the implications of what I've been saying about doctrine. There is a key hidden in there.
Remember that 99% of our doctrine, teachings and emphasis are on the eminent God. Yes, He of physical body. Sort of (read Joseph's King Follett Sermon to see what I mean by "sort of"). We are not like the Gnostics or even Creedal Christians, who ascribe to the belief that physicality cannot be sublime or perfect. We consider that to be a notion that does not describe things as they are. Mostly.
I do not believe that God is 'permanently incarnate', though I *never* speak of that in Church, because that view has to do with His transcendent nature. It is not a part of what the Church is about, even if it is true. Might seem complicated, but Heavenly Father is helping me through it.
I believe the Church is justified in this self-limitation of the view of God's nature, because of the mission of the Church. And the weakness of man. I see where it all fits very well. But I couldn't, without the guidance and inspiration that God has granted me. And I know because of this process, that *I* cannot teach it to another. And I'm not, I'm just telling you some of my thoughts.
Mystery, perplexity, enigma, cypher, parable, symbol, paradox. When the mind cannot describe, when the ineffable reveals itself to you, what do you do? You just go with it.
Let's take, as an example, Saul's conversion experience. Was God transcendent there? How about the stoning martyrdom of Stephen -- Was God transcendent, or immanent there? How about the mount of transfiguration? Did the Apostles REALLY see something there? There's plenty to contemplate.
HiJolly