Looking for an answer.

[Hiker104]

Hi, I am 18 years old and live in Utah county and have been LDS all my life. I decided that before i went on my mission i would learn for myself if the church is true. I have read the BOM once and also listened to it on tape also. I didn't think it would happen but I am having major doubts about the church now. I haven't received any revelation or answers about the church or about Joseph Smith and the BOM. Ive been searching for 5 weeks now and i haven't come up with anything except more doubts and more questions. I know to recieve the spirit you need to be living the gospel and to want to know with a sincere heart and am trying my best to accomplish both of those. I am not quite sure what to expect as an answer. By no means do I expect an angel to come floating into my room and tell me its true or anything like that and to tell you the truth Im not quite what to expect. Everyone always talks about a burning in the bosom, they felt peaceful about it etc. but so far I don't think I have felt either of those.

I am feeling a lot of pressure to just go and serve a mission and know that if i don't i will probably lose a lot of friends and let down my family, but i refuse to serve due to social pressure, which if you have ever lived in Utah county is gigantic and guys who do not serve are considered to either have committed a grave sin and cannot go or just want to go live a sinful life, neither of which is me. I cannot tell people that something is true and convert them to it when I am unsure of that very thing myself. I cannot lie to myself and others, which is why I feel like I need to gain a testimony of it for myself. I have no problem serving a mission in fact i have all the money saved for it its just I can't bring myself to go and teach something I don't fully believe in. I haven't discredited or decided that the church is 100% false or anything like that and will continue to try to get an answer on whether its true or not but I am very discouraged at the moment and unsure what to do.

I guess I am just afraid that I won't ever receive anything at all and be left in this state of bouncing back and forth wondering if it is really a divinely inspired church, or if that we are just alone on this planet and that this is it.

Can anyone offer my any advice if they have gone through the same thing?

Thanks

[ceeboo]

Hello Hiker104,

I will leave the BofM advice to many more capable and indeed devout loving LDS members to share with you. ( As I am not LDS )

I will offer a short response for your consideration, if I may.

Stay on your journey, we are all on our own and I would strongly encourage you to just keep on yours . I would add that you are very young and you may indeed find many turns and obstacles along the way but IMHO the most important thing is to keep contributing, sharing, extending and excepting love.

God bless,
Carl

[BenRaines]

Answers like this come after much fasting and prayer. We are taught in the Doctrine & Covenants, when talking about spiritual gifts, that to some it is given to believe on the testimonies of those who know and to others is given the gift of knowing.

We are also taught to make a determination for ourselves and then take it to the Lord in prayer. Don't ask "Tell me that it is true or not". Say in your prayers "I have taken Moroni's challenge, I have read these things and have studied them out in my mind. I believe them to be true, please confirm by the Holy Ghost the truth of these things". Something along that line.

Please do not serve a mission just for peer pressure, you will make a mission very difficult for those who have prepared for a lifetime of service. I served with two such missionaries and they wasted a lot of my time in the mission. Doctrine and Covenants 4 teaches if you have a desire to serve you are called to the work. If you have a desire to serve others, not due to peer pressure, but a desire to serve others, notice it doesn't say to convert others but to serve them, you are called to the work.

Ben Raines

[Wingnut]

Originally Posted by BenRaines

Answers like this come after much fasting and prayer. We are taught in the Doctrine & Covenants, when talking about spiritual gifts, that to some it is given to believe on the testimonies of those who know and to others is given the gift of knowing.

We are also taught to make a determination for ourselves and then take it to the Lord in prayer. Don't ask "Tell me that it is true or not". Say in your prayers "I have taken Moroni's challenge, I have read these things and have studied them out in my mind. I believe them to be true, please confirm by the Holy Ghost the truth of these things". Something along that line.

Please do not serve a mission just for peer pressure, you will make a mission very difficult for those who have prepared for a lifetime of service. I served with two such missionaries and they wasted a lot of my time in the mission. Doctrine and Covenants 4 teaches if you have a desire to serve you are called to the work. If you have a desire to serve others, not due to peer pressure, but a desire to serve others, notice it doesn't say to convert others but to serve them, you are called to the work.

Ben Raines

Ben, you took the words right out of my mouth. I was going to quote that very scripture in D&C:

13 To some it is given by the Holy Ghost to know that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, and that he was crucified for the sins of the world.
14 To others it is given to believe on their words, that they also might have eternal life if they continue faithful.

It immediately came to mind because it was once shared with me when I wondered if I had a testimony.

I also echo the sentiment of not going on a mission just for the sake of going, because you're expected to do so. If you feel the need to wait a year or two, do it. You can still go up to your 26th birthday (unless that cutoff has changed in the last few years).

One more thing I'd like to add: just because you aren't comfortable saying "I know..." doesn't mean you don't have a testimony. There are many levels of testimony. There is "I hope it's true," there is "I think it's true," there is "I believe it's true," and there is "I know it's true." I didn't have the "I know..." moment about the Book of Mormon until I was partway through my mission. I never had the "moment" about the Church in general. I just kind-of always knew, and after questioning and getting nowhere, I gave up and realized that I just knew. You may find the same. You may not. But don't be afraid to be comfortable with "I believe..."

[Misshalfway]

Doubt is to be expected when someone sets out on the path of discovering truth for themselves. This is what Satan does best. He mixes a little fear with doubt and tries to get us to turn back or turn away. So, I think just know whose voice it is inside your head. The temptations of fear and doubt follow truth. So....its a good sign.

You can even read the scriptures and see what others did when faced with doubt and fear.

Remember that feeling these emotions is not as important as what you think about them and then what you do about them. Be believing. Believe that God will give you an answer either way. If we lack wisdom, God commanded that we go to him. So do that! And believe he will give you an answer. Maybe even plant yourself in that determination until he does!! Know he will, even though you don't see the evidence of it yet. That is faith. And faith leads to knowledge. So hang on, the light will come.
He may not give the answer until you have done the work you need to prepare your mind for that answer. I agree that he requires that we use our best guess before we ask.

Fear and doubt are not answers in and of themselves, so don't rely on them to be answers from God. God's answers are peaceful and sure. So, one way or the other follow the spirt. It will tell you how things really are. It will tell you and it will show you and teach you the truth of all things. It won't scare you away from the false. It may warn. It may give a 'no', but even those answers come in peace and surety.

I needed an answer once. Everyone in my life wanted me to marry this boy. And he was a cutie. He told me he "knew" I was to be his wife. But, I just wasn't sure. I was filled with fear and doubt. He was putting pressure. My parents loved him and thought I was being silly or afraid of commitment. I prayed for weeks. I studied and pondered what I wanted and weighed my concerns. And I felt nothing. I was getting impatient frankly and I told God I would not stop asking the question until he answered! No answer.

Then, I decided to bag the waiting and make my own choice. I did that while I was putting on my mascara one day. Then a whisper came to my heart. It said, "Ask me one more time." So I went in my bedroom. I knelt at my bed. I said "Father, I don't want to marry this boy. Is that the right thing...." And before the words were completely out of my mouth, the most beautiful, comforting, feeling came into my mind and body and heart. I could feel it physically and it settled the question in my mind absolutely. I knew my decision was sure. I said no to the boy. Devistated him. I told my parents. Disappointed them. But, I KNEW my choice was the right one. And I never looked back or second guessed that decision. Not ever. I now know more about why it wasn't right and my parents are so glad I listened to the Spirit.

Trust the process. The process is what has sustained me in my spiritual learnings. It doesn't matter the question. Banish the fear. Go forward in faith and choose your best choice and trust that Father will direct your path.

Best wishes. And just know.....it is rare that we gain our testimonies without passing thru struggle first.

[Wingnut]

Originally Posted by Misshalfway

Then, I decided to bag the waiting and make my own choice. I did that while I was putting on my mascara one day. Then a whisper came to my heart. It said, "Ask me one more time." So I went in my bedroom. I knelt at my bed. I said "Father, I don't want to marry this boy. Is that the right thing...." And before the words were completely out of my mouth, the most beautiful, comforting, feeling came into my mind and body and heart. I could feel it physically and it settled the question in my mind absolutely. I knew my decision was sure. I said no to the boy. Devistated him. I told my parents. Disappointed them. But, I KNEW my choice was the right one. And I never looked back or second guessed that decision. Not ever. I now know more about why it wasn't right and my parents are so glad I listened to the Spirit.

I hope you didn't start crying and smudge your mascara.

Actually, I think it's funny how we remember the insignificant side-happenings of important spiritual moments in our lives.

[Loudmouth_Mormon]

Originally Posted by Hiker104

I am feeling a lot of pressure to just go and serve a mission and know that if i don't i will probably lose a lot of friends and let down my family, but i refuse to serve due to social pressure

Wow - what kind of crappy friend would cut someone out of their lives because they didn't go on a mission! I mean, I can see growing off in different directions and not having things in common anymore and losing contact, stuff like that - but dang - are you saying you know people will actively halt a friendship? Man - whether you actually get an answer to your prayers or not, you may want to consider if such a friendship is worth having.

I cannot tell people that something is true and convert them to it when I am unsure of that very thing myself. I cannot lie to myself and others, which is why I feel like I need to gain a testimony of it for myself.

Kudos to you. I've encountered missionaries who were just there because it was expected of them. I've encountered bitter church critics who tried to lie their way through because it was expected of them. I respect your decision to not lie.

I guess I am just afraid that I won't ever receive anything at all and be left in this state of bouncing back and forth wondering if it is really a divinely inspired church, or if that we are just alone on this planet and that this is it.

Doubt is normal, healthy, and useful. You are right - it needs to be resolved. Unresolved doubt festers and starts to break things.

Can anyone offer my any advice if they have gone through the same thing?

Here you go - I wrote this a few years back. Hope it helps.

Alma 32:27 But behold, if ye will awake and arouse your faculties, even to an experiment upon my words, and exercise a particle of faith, yea, even if ye can no more than desire to believe, let this desire work in you, even until ye believe in a manner that ye can give place for a portion of my words.

Moroni 10:4 And when ye shall receive these things, I would exhort you that ye would ask God, the Eternal Father, in the name of Christ, if these things are not true; and if ye shall ask with a sincere heart, with real intent, having faith in Christ, he will manifest the truth of it unto you, by the power of the Holy Ghost.

The first scripture promises a slowly evolving process from faith to knowledge, through the assumption that if it looks good, and acts good, and produces good fruit, then it is good. Not really enough to base a testimony on, in my opinion. But Moroni promised something else - "he will manifest the truth of it unto you, by the power of the Holy Ghost.". That sounded a little more like it. So, when I looked at the verse, it laid out my side of the bargain:

1- "And when ye shall receive these things" - Before it would work, I had to read the Book of Mormon. But more than read it, to "receive" it. I had to internalize it - deeply reading for meaning, more than just a cursory glance. Not a critical reading, looking for faults. I had to read it, with the notion that it very well might be exactly what it claimes to be - scripture. True. The word of God. A literal history of people who literally lived.

2- "I would exhort you that ye would ask God, the Eternal Father, in the name of Christ, if these things are not true"
So, I had to pray. Not just pray, but pray in the name of Christ. That means, I had to be worthy of his name. The guy who owns The Simsons brand, will let any amount of stupid garbage bear the name - Bart Simpson toothpaste, cheap flimsy Homer travel mugs, stupid T-shirts make out of inferior materials, whatever. But Jesus is more choosy. If you are going to bear his name, you need to be following his teachings.

This is possible to do, without actually believing in him. After all, I follow some of Sun-Tzu's "art of war" notions, but I don't believe he is a god, and I also don't share his faith. The best advice for a happy marriage, the notion that I've used as a foundation for mine, came from a drunk Tongan I met in an alleyway one night. I follow that advice daily, yet I'm not a big fan of the guy who gave it to me.

So, to take upon myself the name of Christ, I had to do and be a couple of main things:
* Not sinning
* Loving my neighbor
* Desiring to know a God I could love

I did not have to be perfect, I figured it was a matter of heart. It wasn't how close to my destination I was, it mattered only that my compass was pointed in the right direction, and I was following it. Yes, there was some doubt about what the compass was pointing to - was it true north, or just wishful thinking. But that didn't matter - I was just trying to satisfy this part of the scripture - and be able to pray in the name of Christ.

So, I prayed. I prayed nightly, starting about halfway through the book. I prayed fervently. My prayers were short and simple: "Dear Heavenly Father, if thou exist, thou knowest my heart. Thou knowest I am sincere. I desire to know of the truthfulness of this work. Please show it to me. In the name of thy son, Jesus Christ, amen". Simple, plain, sincere, over and over again.

3- "and if ye shall ask with a sincere heart, with real intent, having faith in Christ,"
Ok - 3 requirements - and I had to have all 3 of them. In years past, I had read the BoM and prayed in the name of Christ, and got nothing. I was missing real intent - I figured I wouldn't get an answer, and praying was a way of proving my guess true.
It's about where my heart is. It needs to be sincere, not with an ulterior motive, burdened by unrepented of sin, or trying to get something else out of the experience. My intent had to be true. No faith, no promise.

I can't impress enough on everyone, the importance of these 3 items. They're related, but if you are missing one, don't be expecting anything. If you are having a hard time figuring out where you are on these 3, you're probably not there.

Throughout the process, I was comfortable with my part of the bargain. It was like showing up for a test being very, very well prepared - there's a confidence based on the fact that you know what you're doing. I wasn't lying to myself, or bending any rules, or figuring out the least I could do to satisfy the bare minimum - I was there, and there solidly.

I did not believe in God - but I didn't have to. I just had to want to. I was not setting aside doubts - they held the center stage.

4- "He will manifest the truth of it unto you, by the power of the Holy Ghost."

So, what can I say - it happened.

It happened at work, where I was a candy maker, with an arm covered with chocolate. (If you've ever been to a fancy hotel, or taken a fancy cruise, and there's a chocolate mint on your pillow - that's what I used to make by hand.)

The details? Here is where I need to be a bit vague, in order to avoid embarassing stuff about someone who is not me. I was working away quietly, thinking about reality, wondering if I'd ever know what it was, and thinking about an unresolved situation in my life. I was at a crossroads, only tangentially related to my quest to discover the truth about the Book of Mormon. As I thought about this crossroads, trying to discern what to make out of the facts before me, I thought something along the lines of "Well, this pattern indicates that things are moving in the right direction... "

And it happened.

Words can't really explain it - they can only approximate it.

It was unmistakable, not a warm fuzzy, not an emotional reaction.

I had my answer. It was "yes".

It was a strong, internal sensation. Not a feeling - I wasn't happy or sad. The best word is "confirmation" . And what was it confirming? Many things. It was confirming that yes, I had just said something true - the pattern I was looking at was indeed moving in the right direction. It confirmed that there WAS a right direction. It confirmed that this notion of reality that I had looked at - this bizarre tale of prophets and plates and revelations and restorations, had the added benefit of being true.

A few side details:
* The first thing that dawned on me was, "My gosh, this is the Holy Ghost speaking with me!" The second thought that came a few minutes later was "My gosh, I've felt this before!" In one or two of the most stressful times of my life, I had felt that sensation before. I had written off the experience at the time, but realization flooded me - the Lord had stood by me, even while I was inactive.

* Other people tell me their conversion stories, and they are often different. My Bishop, as a young man, was watching a sunset, and said a brief prayer "thank you, God", and heard the words as clear as day "You'll be all right - I'll always take care of you". My experience was different. Another guy from my ward had been desiring to feel the Love of Christ - and felt it unexpectedly when he stood up to shake hands with a brother from another ward. They stood there with clasped hands, with tears flowing down both their faces. My experience was different - there was not a lot of emotion (although I pretty soon felt exhilleration, as it sank in what was happening). My wife's grandfather was on a bar stool 40 years ago, having left the church, and was almost knocked to the floor by the words "Wayne, why hast thou forsaken me?" I heard no words. The energy and the impact was internal to me, not external like it was to him.

* I have since felt this impression, this confirmation, quite often. As I returned to church in full force, keeping my baptismal covenant, the Holy Ghost has been, at points in my life, my constant companion.

* I have since been able to test this "answer", this influence of the spirit, this burning in the bosom, fairly scientifically. I've been able, once, to "switch" it on and off several times, by asking the Lord in prayer "should I do this?.... should I not do this?... should I do this?"

LM

[Gwen]

leave ut for awhile..... we are always looking for members here lol j/k kinda, we are always looking for members....

i'm serious about leaving ut though. a few months, away for yourself. take away the social pressures to be or decide anything. slow down and simplify life a little. learn how you receive revelation or refine what you already know. make a decision then go home. i agree with those who say do not go for social pressure, but also make sure you don't do the oposite, refuse to go for fear it will look like you went for social pressure.

[ElderJAR]

Hey, I just turned 19, and I am going to serve a mission...ever since I was 14 years old I had many questions...about the church...the book of mormon...etc...as you gain a testimony of the book or mormon, your desire to serve a mission will increase so much. I read the book of mormon 4 times, and I believed that it was true...I couldnt really disprove it...plus, I did feel that it was right in my heart...but I wanted more. There's this really neat book called "The Book of Mormon Another Witness of Jesus Christ: ON TRIAL" and basically it puts the book of mormon in a court case, and there are lawyers that throw every accusation that you could imagine at the book of mormon, but the book of mormon disproves each accusation. It's a pretty thick comic book but it's worth the read...you could probably find it on amazon.com...I highly recommend it...when you finish the book, you realize that there's no possible way that a guy with a 3rd grader's education could have written such a book that cannot be disproved and has changed the lives of so many people on the earth today. Good luck with your testimony...if anything you can just message me any doubts that you may have because I'm sure that theyve gone through my thoughts as well.
Good Luck!

[Misshalfway]

Doubt is normal, healthy, and useful. You are right - it needs to be resolved. Unresolved doubt festers and starts to break things.

Another great tidbit of truth from the great LM.

Awesome!