excommunicated tonight. question about timeline

[Misshalfway]

I am surprised your priesthood leaders didn't discuss this directly with you. Perhaps they are planning to as time goes on.

[Charlyc]

Originally Posted by Misshalfway

I am surprised your priesthood leaders didn't discuss this directly with you. Perhaps they are planning to as time goes on.

Doubt it. I never did because the interview usually centres on repentance and change not the technicalities of the process.

[freedom112]

Charlyc

Thanks for the helpful information. I have another question for you that you may or may not have an answer to. I know that these things are all situational. I am now remarried. We would like to be sealed. Will that ever be an option for me? If so, how long after I have my temple blessings restored would a request for a temple cancellation from my first husband even be considered? Also, my sin did not end my first marriage. It all happened between marriages. I know that it is a case by case basis. Have you ever seen anything like this? Do we have any chance at ever being sealed?

[Charlyc]

Originally Posted by freedom112

Charlyc

Thanks for the helpful information. I have another question for you that you may or may not have an answer to. I know that these things are all situational. I am now remarried. We would like to be sealed. Will that ever be an option for me? If so, how long after I have my temple blessings restored would a request for a temple cancellation from my first husband even be considered? Also, my sin did not end my first marriage. It all happened between marriages. I know that it is a case by case basis. Have you ever seen anything like this? Do we have any chance at ever being sealed?

Yes certainly. Your case is really a normal standard request for annulment which goes through ok without much hassles -unless they for some odd reason, they feel inspired to deny it or there are minors involved in that sin. Note that the restoration of blessings is something they want to see happen, since its 'only' restoring what you had before, and they do all they can to make it happen if you show that you've repented off course. But an annulment is seen slightly different in that they there is a question asked and a reliance on a revelation for the answer.

But as to time, no, as soon as the restoration is done you can start to prepare the paperwork. You ought to mention this to the GA who interviews you for the restoration and better still have your husband there for the ordinance, they will record that in their forms for the 1st presidency.

[freedom112]

Originally Posted by Charlyc

By the way, although its good to aim for a sealing and we are all encouraged to do this, the church actually will 'seal' by proxy all members who were married on earth five years after all concerned die, and they do this automatically and to all the spouses we may have had. I guess its a 'just in case thing', not sure, but we do do this. The computer presents the names automatically when its time to do it in a Temple as part of the names they have there to do daily.

Most members don't know about this so I love telling them , so although yes its better to try to be sealed now and have a celestial marriage during our lifetime, no member actually misses out on a sealing if they were married here on earth legally and lawfully. The first presidency also has processes in place for those excommunicated who then died without rebaptism but they keep that part more secret and we at the stake level don't see those cases.

So yes, its good to try to be sealed when you can but don't be too worried about it. If you are worthy and have a marriage the Lord approves of then one way or another the sealing will get done.

A the best

So if I were to meet with an Apostle and he were to say "no, you can not be sealed" I would not have to worry because at some point it would be "automatic" after death? This does not make sense. It seems like you would either be sealed or not sealed. If this were the case then all divorced people could skip the earthly sealing process and assume it would be automatic after death. It seems like the deciding factor would be "worthiness" in this life or the next. Perhaps the sealing ordinance is automatic but the actual sealing depends on worthiness.

To be clear I am not worried about this I am just curious.

-Amber

[LDSVALLEY]

My understanding is when you are excommunicated your original baptism is null and void, while a record still exists the church treats it as it is over. If after a year you are worthy then you may get baptized again but the date on your Ward records shows your new baptism date not the old one.

Church policy is a newly baptized person must wait one year from the date of baptism and be worthy in order to attend the temple.

Therefore I would assume you must wait a minimum of two years from the date you were excommunicated until you can attend the full temple. However you can do baptism for the dead after baptism if you are worthy.

PS I admire your desire, most people in your situation I would think would turn against the church. That you seem like you want to work past what ever happened and return must be pleasing to the Lord.

[Charlyc]

Originally Posted by freedom112

So if I were to meet with an Apostle and he were to say "no, you can not be sealed" I would not have to worry because at some point it would be "automatic" after death? This does not make sense. It seems like you would either be sealed or not sealed. If this were the case then all divorced people could skip the earthly sealing process and assume it would be automatic after death. It seems like the deciding factor would be "worthiness" in this life or the next. Perhaps the sealing ordinance is automatic but the actual sealing depends on worthiness.

Yes the deciding factor is worthiness and the 'automatic' is the name at the Temple that the computer brings up as needing a Temple ordinance, but then the Lord can reject or accept it when its done. But whether its of any value depends on the members worthiness and the Spirit confirming the ordinance. Same with marriages, it depends on the worthiness of people to live that level.

Here if the apostle says no, you can wait another year and reapply. But if they keep saying no, then it can be done later via genealogy. Point is though that if the 1st presidency keeps saying no here then maybe the Lord himself is saying no, so even if you are sealed by proxy ie through family history one would have to question whether that will really be accepted by the Lord.

[Charlyc]

Originally Posted by LDSVALLEY

My understanding is when you are excommunicated your original baptism is null and void, while a record still exists the church treats it as it is over. If after a year you are worthy then you may get baptized again but the date on your Ward records shows your new baptism date not the old one.
Church policy is a newly baptized person must wait one year from the date of baptism and be worthy in order to attend the temple.
Therefore I would assume you must wait a minimum of two years from the date you were excommunicated until you can attend the full temple. However you can do baptism for the dead after baptism if you are worthy.

This isn't quite correct and an experienced competent bishop,ward clerk or stake could explain it too. General Handbook of Instruction section on church discipline specifically says that it isn't that way for the re-baptized who were previously endowed. The record is a new temporary one showing the re-baptism date but only until the restoration of blessing is done; at that point the temporary record is destroyed in the ward and everything goes back to how it was before the excommunication. It is a 'Restoration' of the blessings lost at excommunication not a new endowment or new membership . Also section on Marriage and Temples and the interview folder with the temple questions clearly state that members awaiting restoration of blessings can NOT do proxy baptism or hold a limited use recommend.

"Church policy is a newly baptized person..." is correct for the new member not someone who has faced church discipline.k

[Charlyc]

Originally Posted by freedom112

So if I were to meet with an Apostle and he were to say "no, you can not be sealed" I would not have to worry because at some point it would be "automatic" after death?

-Amber

For the annulment you don't get interviewed by GA only SP and bishop. Everything else is done via mail, electronically these days.

The interview with the apostle ,or other GA, will be for the restoration of blessings. And I'd highly recommend that your husband be there with you that day because that does help your later application for annulment

[Dancer1]

I have a friend who went through something similar. He was told by our bishop and stake president that it would be at least a year after rebaptism before he could think about restoration of blessings. In his case it was 15 months later. I had another friend who had her blessings restored exactly 1 year after being rebaptized. I hope that helps and best wishes to you.