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Old 02-14-2008, 02:54 PM
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Moksha, you make a very good point. Just a few centuries ago, the Roman Catholics were burning Protestants to death at the stake, and Calvin and other Protestants were burning Roman Catholics at the stake. Even more recently, we've seen Irish Protestants and Catholics bombing one another in Northern Ireland. Not really a "Christian" thing to be doing, eh? Christ, after all, taught about "turning the other cheek." I'm just not convinced that we (humans) are ready to really be "Christians" in the sense that Jesus taught.

He sought unity amongst his disciples. He taught them charity, Christ-like love, forgiveness, faith, hope, etc. It seems like most Christians (including many LDS Christians) are busier with condemning the other guy to hell, than expressing a Christian love and serving. The mortal Jesus' key sermons are the Sermon on the Mount and at the Sea - which teach us his key principles. They do not teach us to persecute, but rather "blessed is he that IS persecuted for my sake." Concepts such as mercy, poor in spirit, pure in heart, peacemaker, are all part and parcel of what we must become. We are to be a light on the hill and salt with savor. We are to feed the hungry, give drink to the thirsty, clothe the poor and visit those in prison (when was the last time anyone visited a stranger in prison - I work in one, so I do it daily!) - and in so doing when we do it unto the least of these, we have done it unto Christ.

How does telling a Mormon he is loved, but will burn in hell with Joseph Smith if he doesn't repent, complying with Jesus' teachings? What value does regular Christianity offer me, besides animosity and rancorous lies toward something I consider special and of good report, such as the Book of Mormon?

I reviewed a book a couple years ago for a guy that asked me to do so. It purported to bridge traditional Christianity and Mormonism. It started nice, then told his conversion away from Mormonism to traditional Christianity. Then it tried to "nicely" tell the LDS reader they could become decent Christians if they just changed a few things: reject the Book of Mormon, reject Joseph Smith, and tell their Church leaders they wanted their name removed from the Church records! Sad thing is, he didn't really see that his whole book was an attack. Instead of saying, "these are wondrous things I have found and want to share them with you...", his book was "these are the things that are wrong with Mormonism, so come over here, instead." And yes, he finished his book hoping we would listen to his plea, so we wouldn't burn in hell.

OTOH, I've known LDS who have felt that others would "burn in Telestial or Terrestrial hell." While we should offer the opportunity of exaltation to others, we must begin to realize that the Telestial and Terrestrial are HEAVENS and not hell. All individuals will go to the kingdom that is most like their character and being (D&C 88). In trying to save people from Terrestrial Hell, we have this affinity to insult them; just as we are insulted by those traditional Christians that try "loving us" into their version of heaven.

Maybe if all Christians were to concentrate more on what Jesus taught, rather than looking down on those around us because they are "sinners", perhaps we would realize there is more to unite us than divide us.
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Old 02-14-2008, 03:10 PM
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If god is god through procession (he is god because he served his god, who served his god, who….), then that implies that at some point there was a god who always was god or that found a way to become a god on his own. Which is it?

If there was an original god would that mean that the god of this world is a lesser god and that since his power came from this original god that he is not all powerful?

If god is only the god of this world, where did the other worlds come from and why are they lifeless? Why have we not discovered life on other worlds yet?

In Genesis is says that God created the stars. If you believe there are other worlds with other gods then none of these had stars or suns.

If the Bible claims that God is eternal, then how could he have become a god?


We do not know that all worlds are lifeless. We haven;'t investigated all by a long way. Of the ones we have investigated we do not even know if they were at one time inhabited. It could have been so, millenia ago.

We haven't discovered everything yet, but that doesn't mean it isn't there. America was still there even before Columbus sailed the ocean blue.

How do we know how far creation goes? How do we know what there is beyond the things which we are aware of? Infinity is an awful long way. We do not know how many stars/suns there may be with planets (inhabit) in orbit around them, which may have created by other Gods. How do we know that some may have already come and gone? Eternity is a long time.


If a Mormon can claim to be Christian can a Muslim claim the same? Islam believes in the Bible as Christians do. They believe in Jesus (in that he was a prophet). They say they believe in the same God as Christians. They say that they were given the continued and true gospel of God. They too believe in salvation through works.

I'm a Mormon and I claim to be a Christian because I acknowledge the Lord Jesus Christ, the only begotten Son of God in the flesh, as my Saviour. Whatever anyone else thinks of me and my beliefs does not change the fact that Jesus is my Lord. I know he lived and died for my sins as much as anyone else's and as a follower of his teachings and having faith in his atoning sacrifice I believe that entitles me to claim the designation 'Christian'.

As others have said, Muslims do not believe Jesus is the Son of God. They do not believe in his atonement. They revere him as a prophet but no more than Moses, Abraham and they set greater store by Mohammed. They would never wish to be called Christian because they do not accept Christ as their saviour.


How can a Mormon say he is Christian by his own opinion when other Christian denominations do not agree because they do not share the same doctrine? I.E… God always was and always will be, there are no other gods, Jesus is God, and we are saved through Christ and not through works because we can never be good enough through ourselves…. Wouldn’t this be equivalent to me calling myself the President even though nobody else agrees with me?

It doesn't matter to me what other Christians think of me, many have misconceptions about what we Mormons believe and base their opinions on incorrect information. It matters to me what Jesus Christ thinks of me and if he accepts me, which I believe he does. Baptists and Methodists do not share the same doctrine and yet they each describe themselves as Christian.

Mormons do not believe that we earn our salvation by works. That doctrine was taught long before our church existed. We believe we are saved by grace. However we do believe that good works must follow if we are to be obedient to our Heavenly Father. We are told in the scriptures "by their fruits ye shall know them." You calling yourself President even though you are not the President is actually more akin to people saying we Mormons are not Christians even though we are - just because they say it doesn't make it so.
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