Chavez to Castro: 'Comrade' Obama Farther Left Than Us

[Aesa]

Chavez has pretty good reason to hate the US, pretty much for some of the same reasons that I quote "hate" (a strong and inappropriate word) the US government...

Chavez has stood up to the United States and he's done it primarily demanding that Venezuelan oil be used to help the Venezuelan people ... well, they didn't like that in the United States. Yes there have been the (suspicious coups) riots and all that, but it's clear that the people weren't behind those. The people have been so strongly behind Chavez that they've been able to overcome the presence of corruption from the North -- which is a first for Latin American countries.

Chavez, ofcourse, is just as corrupt as the next leader in political office today. I have read an article where he says that Communism is not an appropriate system, I suppose you could call him some kind of socialist ... but it's not easy to distinguish. He has definitely been propagandised by the West, though, as I think is evidenced by many of the posts above me.

[Vort]

Originally Posted by Aesa

Chavez has pretty good reason to hate the US, pretty much for some of the same reasons that I quote "hate" (a strong and inappropriate word) the US government...

If you truly considered it an inappropriate word, you would not have used it. I take your word at face value: You hate the US government.

The US government is elected by and a representative of the US people. If you hate the US government, as you state, then you hate the US citizenry. We are a government of the people.

[Vort]

Originally Posted by Lamayana

You seem to forget that the model of US Capitalism is collapsing with no hope for resurrection. What you call "Communism" in your language, in reality is considered "Compassion" in mine.

Troll.

[Lamayana]

Originally Posted by FunkyTown

Yyyyyyyyes. I should point out as everyone on this board knows that I'm not from the US. I do not live in the US. I was born in Canada and now live in Britain.

And Hugo Chavez isn't a big fan of most western nations. He called Jose' Aznar, the Spanish Prime Minister, a 'Fascist' and actually repeatedly bashed him with the word while he was sitting beside the man. It took the King to say 'Shut up' to him to get him to stop.

Hugo Chavez may be popular locally, and I'm willing to be proven wrong.

Please, feel free to provide links to any speeches that show Hugo Chavez as being a tolerant, broad-minded individual with a moderate political stance.

Maybe something nice about his reactions towards protesters during his removal of presidential term as set out in the Venezuelan Constitution? Maybe something he said nice about the US? I'm certainly more than willing to accept that I might be wrong in this case. After all, international politics is a tricky business. I would love to hear that Hugo Chavez is polite and respectful to those he disagrees with, or who oppose him.

He has said many good comments about the US, but for that you would have to speak Spanish, or I would have to translate them for you. I do not have time or energy to do that, and you don't have any time of motivation to learn Spanish. The media does not really translate any of that into English. The Constitutional Amendment has been passed by popular vote. YouTube - Hugo Chavez Speech with English Translation(Feb. 15th, 2009)

[FunkyTown]

Originally Posted by Lamayana

He has said many good comments about the US, but for that you would have to speak Spanish, or I would have to translate them for you. I do not have time or energy to do that, and you don't have any time of motivation to learn Spanish. The media does not really translate any of that into English. The Constitutional Amendment has been passed by popular vote. YouTube - Hugo Chavez Speech with English Translation(Feb. 15th, 2009)

Please do not assume what I am or am not willing to do. I might have served a mission in a Spanish speaking country (I did not); I might have learned Spanish in school (I did not); I might be willing to run the article through Babelfish (Which I am).

Please, I invite you to prove that he has said 'Many good things' about the US.

He has been in power for over a decade, so I'm certain that you can find 3 articles on Google where he says something good about the US.

And yes, Hugo Chavez did have the popular vote when term limits were abolished. This does not mean that term limits shouldn't exist, merely that he has been able to bring forth prosperity to a country that is traditionally poor.

Of course he's popular. He's made a lot of Venezuelans wealthier than they were before. That does not mean he is their friend. Everything he does screams out Tyranny.


EDIT: I should also point out that I watched your video. He doesn't say anything nice about those who disagree with him or the US or anyone. He simply is talking about patriotism and victory and transforming Venezuela in to an international powerhouse. His joint military exercises with Russia certainly suggest he might be right. He is preaching nationalism, socialism and the revolution that is coming.

None of that makes him a good person. He's charismatic and he has certainly proven the principle of three potatoes, but that does not make him a good person.

[drjme]

Originally Posted by Vort

If you truly considered it an inappropriate word, you would not have used it. I take your word at face value: You hate the US government.

The US government is elected by and a representative of the US people. If you hate the US government, as you state, then you hate the US citizenry. We are a government of the people.

Why do you Americans like to bust this line out? I am on a number of forums and a lot of these comments are tossed about willy nilly, accusations of 'you are a frothing at the mouth america hater, because you don't like the american government you don't like the american people which means you hate me!!!' (exaggerated yes, but basically implied). It's really sad.....
Do you disagree with me when I say that America is on the road to socialism/communism? if yes, then the American people voted for it.
Do you disagree with me when I say that 8 years after the iraq invasion to liberate them, they are no more free and no more better off than they were with saddam, with millions of dead iraqi civilians and Children? who voted that US government in?
Do you disagree with me when I tell you that the US has 'offence' force bases in over 150 countries and that many countries want them out, but the offence forces aren't budging? who voted for that oppression?
Who voted for abu ghraib and torture?
Who voted for American security forces that operate in Iraq outside of American forces control, under corporate control, that roam wantonly as armed to the teeth mercenaries (formerly known as blackwater etc)?
and on and on.......

Well YOU did of course, with your democratically elected government by choice of the people, a government that endorses all of the above. YOU must be responsible yes?

[FunkyTown]

Originally Posted by drjme

Why do you Americans like to bust this line out? I am on a number of forums and a lot of these comments are tossed about willy nilly, accusations of 'you are a frothing at the mouth america hater, because you don't like the american government you don't like the american people which means you hate me!!!' (exaggerated yes, but basically implied). It's really sad.....
Do you disagree with me when I say that America is on the road to socialism/communism? if yes, then the American people voted for it.
Do you disagree with me when I say that 8 years after the iraq invasion to liberate them, they are no more free and no more better off than they were with saddam, with millions of dead iraqi civilians and Children? who voted that US government in?
Do you disagree with me when I tell you that the US has 'offence' force bases in over 150 countries and that many countries want them out, but the offence forces aren't budging? who voted for that oppression?
Who voted for abu ghraib and torture?
Who voted for American security forces that operate in Iraq outside of American forces control, under corporate control, that roam wantonly as armed to the teeth mercenaries (formerly known as blackwater etc)?
and on and on.......

Well YOU did of course, with your democratically elected government by choice of the people, a government that endorses all of the above. YOU must be responsible yes?

I would say you are partially right, Dr. Of course, most of what you're saying are exaggerations designed to raise a point. No American voted for Abu Ghraib and torture, but there are a lot of Americans who agree with it(There are numerous posts that say this). Is it the majority? I would say no.

Most Americans certainly do not like huge military expenditures on nations that don't want them in there, so I would say they didn't vote for that.

Do most Americans like Blackwater? I would say most Americans don't like American soldiers coming home in bodybags, so the deniability of Blackwater appeals to them.


You're right - Everyone -is- responsible. Therein lies the problem: When everyone's responsible, it's easy to believe no one is responsible.

[drjme]

Originally Posted by FunkyTown

I would say you are partially right, Dr. Of course, most of what you're saying are exaggerations designed to raise a point. No American voted for Abu Ghraib and torture, but there are a lot of Americans who agree with it(There are numerous posts that say this). Is it the majority? I would say no.

Most Americans certainly do not like huge military expenditures on nations that don't want them in there, so I would say they didn't vote for that.

Do most Americans like Blackwater? I would say most Americans don't like American soldiers coming home in bodybags, so the deniability of Blackwater appeals to them.


You're right - Everyone -is- responsible. Therein lies the problem: When everyone's responsible, it's easy to believe no one is responsible.

Vort said that because Aesa hates the American Government, he hates the citizenry because they voted them in. If you look at it that way, I'm saying Because the citizenry voted the government in, the citizenry are responsible for these above issues and actions (the issues themselves are not exaggerated). Just applying the same logic.
They do not vote for these things directly, but rather in ignorance. Obama is full steam ahead with a continuation of bu$h's plans, except he leads the way with catch phrases like 'hope' and 'change'. There is no change, so what hope do we have.... he has pulled out of many if not most of his election promises, watch this:

The Obama deception

for a run down, if you guys really care about the direction of your nation, and PLEASE try to disprove it, instead of trying to attack the messenger.

I like this video:
YouTube - System Of A Down - Boom!
more of it is needed for real change.

sorry if I come across a bit overbearing, I am just passionate about the issue.
edit: oh... and funky don't think that becasue I'm quoting your post i'm trying to argue/disagree or have a go at you....I'm not

[Lamayana]

Originally Posted by FunkyTown

Please do not assume what I am or am not willing to do. I might have served a mission in a Spanish speaking country (I did not); I might have learned Spanish in school (I did not); I might be willing to run the article through Babelfish (Which I am).

Please, I invite you to prove that he has said 'Many good things' about the US.

He has been in power for over a decade, so I'm certain that you can find 3 articles on Google where he says something good about the US.

And yes, Hugo Chavez did have the popular vote when term limits were abolished. This does not mean that term limits shouldn't exist, merely that he has been able to bring forth prosperity to a country that is traditionally poor.

Of course he's popular. He's made a lot of Venezuelans wealthier than they were before. That does not mean he is their friend. Everything he does screams out Tyranny.


EDIT: I should also point out that I watched your video. He doesn't say anything nice about those who disagree with him or the US or anyone. He simply is talking about patriotism and victory and transforming Venezuela in to an international powerhouse. His joint military exercises with Russia certainly suggest he might be right. He is preaching nationalism, socialism and the revolution that is coming.

None of that makes him a good person. He's charismatic and he has certainly proven the principle of three potatoes, but that does not make him a good person.

What makes you a good person? How do I know you? How do we know Pres. Obama, if we never met him in person neither have spoken with him on the phone? Have we ever gone to dinner with Michael Jackson? How do we know that the things that are written in the media about him are true or false, if all we have is comments given by people in the attempt to slander someone else? Pres. Chavez has not made the wealthier wealthier. On the contrary, made the bitter poor dare to dream with a life of betterment. Here is a translated film to English. I hope you may perhaps start to perceive the nature of giving to others as Christ would have done.

El Sistema - a film by Paul Smaczny & Maria Stodtmeier

I pray for your understanding to open up to the perception of realities that are not necessarily identical to your own. Other countries in the Americas are making choices in which the norms adopted by individual people in United States are not necessarily seen as a ruling norm for them. You should respect your neighbor's right to their own choices, and it is your right to disagree, but you have no justification in slandering the process of countries that are developing beyond the exclusion and social disarray that are not being yet solved in your own country for the benefit of those whom Jesus came to serve.

But, you are right: Chavez does not say anything negative or positive against the USA, but he encourages their people to betterment, that their country too may one day stand up to an International competition as other countries rich in natural resources have done. You are saying quite a lot against the Venezuelan government where you don't have a word to say and do not even have an understanding of their culture, language and traditions. How are you being respectful of some other country's sovereignty?

[jadams_4040]

Originally Posted by bytor2112

Article here

I surely swear i read that you promised to quit this "anti obama crap". if someone said anything about george bush even remotely close to the things yu say; they would be branded as unpatriotic. now all of a sudden its a differant standard?