FAMILY PROBLEMS...any advice?

[rameumptom]

You missed my point, which is shown by your example. Is the relationship you have with your son the type you would wish to have? Given he's not living your rules or in your house, I would suppose not. You are giving him unconditional love on your part, but he is not reciprocating that love. This makes the relationship one-sided. Nothing wrong with that, except there is a limited relationship.

The Godhead works as a relationship, because all members of it are equally yoked and invested in loving each other equally. While the Godhead may love Satan in the way you love your misguided son, there is a severe limitation to the relationship, because at least one side refuses to accept the other's actions/methods/beliefs. This does not change the fact that God has divine love. It does, however, affect the relationship.

Relationships must be two-sided, in order to be celestial on all parts. Christ prayed for his disciples on both continents, asking they be one in him and he is one with the Father (John 17, 3 Ne 19). While Christ can love them all in his divine way, for a relationship to exist requires both parties to enter into it. To the extent that two beings are involved in a relationship, they are relating. The deeper they enter into a loving relationship, the more they relate. If one loves and the other hates, then there is no true relationship occurring - there is only one-way events happening.

[piper]

Ashley loves her dad and his problems are tearing her apart.

First, on this part, this is not an excuse for her behavior. Many children have gone through much worse and turned out ok. I could give you many, many examples of this from my 15 years as a counselor.

Her intended major was nursing (RN).
Reality check for her on this. As long as she has a drug/alcohol problem she will not be a nurse even if she can pass the courses which it appears she lacks the discipline to do. If she gets a criminal record due to drugs she will be unlicenseable unless she can get them expunged. In Utah, a DUI/drug related offense can be kept from expungement for 7 years or more.


She had been coming home drunk and stoned and sharing a bed with my 1st grade daughter...which has infuriated me!

And it should worry you. IMHO you have a responsibility to the younger children in your home. Not only to protect them from such influences in your home, but the potential for physical/emotional harm from someone who is out of control and they have the need to feel safe and secure in their home. I know it is difficult to imagine that she might hurt someone, but a person on drugs/alcohol often does unimaginable things and then blames the drug. In fact, they are responsible as they chose to use. If you keep letting her back in your home as is, you are tacitly approving of her lifestyle.

I told Ashley that she cannot move back in with us since she broke her word about college. In truth...part of my reason was that I can't stand her being drunk and stoned around the little ones and she can't respect my feelings on that matter. Her addictions have rendered her incapable of making decent moral decision...IMHO.

Good, except that IMHO you need to be completely honest with her. A behavior not confronted cannot be changed. She needs to know that you cannot have her around your little ones when she is drunk and/or stoned.

Any suggestions? Do you feel that I did the right thing? Ashley accuses me of treating her different because she's not my "real" daughter...but I don't feel that this is fair.

This is classic manipulation. Addicts are very adept at getting people to give in to them. She knows you care about her and will use that to get what she wants.

She will not go to treatment and she does not admit that she is in over her head.[/QUOTE]
That needs to be the first step. However, you can't make her change. You can love her, care for her etc. but she appears to be disrupting the family and gives no thought to the impact on the little ones or you. Jesus loved all unconditionally, but he still drove the moneychangers out of his fathers (and his) house. They were violating the rules, being disruptive and a very bad influence on the people. Yes, pray for her, tell her you love her and care, but, She will have to come to the point that she decides to change on her own. I hope that she does in fact do that before much worse happens. I realize that I have worded this quite strongly. I don't mean to offend. I have just worked with this type of behavior for a long time. I know people must be held accountable and the little ones protected as much as possible. I also know she may say she hates you for this and it will be hard. I pray you have the strength to carry on and that your family prospers.

[SisterofJared]

bubbaman, I've gone through a bit of this with my oldest son. He is an alcoholic. During the time he lived at home, there was not a problem. It wasn't until after he married and divorced that he turned to alcohol... his answer to the pain from the divorce. Still, even knowing the reason, we couldn't accept it. I remember him coming home and hanging on to the wall in order to walk down the hallway. I saw him come in the house and then fall in the front room floor. It tore me apart to see. I, too, had other kids at home... teenagers. It was devastating to all of us.

Finally I sat my son down when he was sober and told him that next time he went out to drink, he better make sure he had somewhere to go, because if he came to my house I would turn him away. I told him that it would hurt me very much and that I would cry, but that I would turn him away. And I meant it. He never came to my house drunk or drinking again. It hasn't cured his alcoholism, but it has made it so the rest of us don't have to deal with it on a daily basis anymore.

Few things are more destructive to the home that a family member coming in drunk or drugged up. Instantly the spirit flees and an awkwardness fills the room. They are totally unaware of this, and continue with whatever behavior they think is okay... sometimes even more harmful. Stupid humor that isn't funny, anger that is misplaced, lectures from their seemingly superior intelligence, coaxing others to join them in harmful activities... if you're lucky, they're sleep it off without any of these. But often you're not lucky. We were blessed in the fact that all of my other children still at home used their brother as an example of the harm alcohol does, and after seeing him, they determined they would NEVER drink alcohol. But they were old enough to see the harm it had done. Smaller children would have a much harder tme judging that.... they would feel the awkwardness, miss the spirit, but not have the tools to evaluate what was going on.

My personal opinion is that you should not let your 19 year old daughter back in your home while she is under the influence ever again. Tell her you love her, set some guidelines, turn her away if she comes home under the influence, and cry. Let the younger kids see you cry and understand that you are broken-hearted that you have to turn her away.

The hardest thing on earth to do, I think, would be to turn away your child during the winter. I am SO grateful my son didn't push it to that after our talk. Because if he had come home drunk, I would have turn him away.... absolutely mandatory after that talk, or else you re-inforce the bad behavior rather than the good. I would have handed him a blanket or two and let him sleep in the car. I would have cried all night, and prayed like crazy. I am soooooo grateful he listened and never pushed it again.

Remember it's HER choice, not yours. You really have no choice, because you must care for your other children.

Good luck!

Sister of Jared.

[Moksha]

This sounds like a case for tough love. Some former addicts have said they needed to hit rock bottom before turning themselves around.

[maria1981]

hi everyone

this is a very sad thing,

i too know all about this from ur daughters side more than being the parent

drugs is a big thing u cant just stop because someone wonts u too the bottom line is she has to hit rock bottom before she will listen to u
some people never stop and others change as soon as they relize this is not the place for them
she has a dad also who is in prison and thats hard for her to deal with and get her head around she doesnt see drugs in the same way as u infact its like food not realy a big deal

just be strong and love her always treat her as ur own

if u let her be free and dont have her live with u she will just get wrose drink and drugs are an easy option

have u spoken to ur doctors about any of this thier are tones of help out thier for ur family even for u on how to deal with this

school is a big no no u wont change her or get anywhere

if u need to talk about this with someone who knows first hand mail me i will give u the facts and mybe help u on whot to do

but go to ur doctors get her some real help and i dont mean going to see someone to talk about ur problems that wont work

[applepansy]

Originally Posted by rameumptom

You missed my point, which is shown by your example. Is the relationship you have with your son the type you would wish to have? Given he's not living your rules or in your house, I would suppose not. You are giving him unconditional love on your part, but he is not reciprocating that love. This makes the relationship one-sided. Nothing wrong with that, except there is a limited relationship.

The Godhead works as a relationship, because all members of it are equally yoked and invested in loving each other equally. While the Godhead may love Satan in the way you love your misguided son, there is a severe limitation to the relationship, because at least one side refuses to accept the other's actions/methods/beliefs. This does not change the fact that God has divine love. It does, however, affect the relationship.

Relationships must be two-sided, in order to be celestial on all parts. Christ prayed for his disciples on both continents, asking they be one in him and he is one with the Father (John 17, 3 Ne 19). While Christ can love them all in his divine way, for a relationship to exist requires both parties to enter into it. To the extent that two beings are involved in a relationship, they are relating. The deeper they enter into a loving relationship, the more they relate. If one loves and the other hates, then there is no true relationship occurring - there is only one-way events happening.

No I didn't miss your point. Human relationships are not celestial. And often relationships are one-sided. We are commanded by Christ to "Love one Another, even as I have love you." That doesn't mean we love them only when they love us back or when they do what we want them to. We are suppose to love them regardless.

If Bubbaman and his wife can love their daughter unconditionally, with the true love of Christ (unconditionally), there will come a time when their relationship with their dauthter will blossom. I know you can love someone out of destructive behavior, with the help of Christ.

applepansy

[theBUBBAMANcan]

Originally Posted by applepansy

I know you can love someone out of destructive behavior, with the help of Christ.

applepansy

This whole situation will give me a good chance to test this idea.

Thanks everyone for all of your replies. All of you had something to say that I can learn something from.

I think it is going to take a long time to get to a "happy ending" to this situation. Ashley has plenty of family members that care about her. Her whole family on her dad's side are LDS and have been trying to help. My wife and I are telling her the same things that she's hearing from the rest of her family; that she has a problem.

Her attitude right now is that she is too young to take life seriously and she is convinced that she has "plenty of time" grow up at some future date.

I had hoped that her "rock bottom" would be her car accident. Sadly, she still is not willing to recognize that she has a problem.

[georgia2]

I agree with applepansy, lillered, and where was grandma when she was getting high?

No way let this girl back in the home stoned or drunk. NO WAY let her sleep with 1st grade daughter. Sick as it may sound, you don't know what goes on in there. (TAKE MY ADVICE)

There's no better time like the present to find out the cruel consequences of stupid decisions. She has been and still is making stupid decisions. To continue to allow her to come back time after time repeating the same things are stupid decisions you and your wife are making. Are members allowed to enter the temple if they don't qualify? Aren't we told by the General authorities that our homes are temples? People on drugs and alcohol are under the influence of Satan. Plain and simple. SUre she may be a sweet and good girl underneath, but underneath is not what is showing. She's legally an adult. Your younger children need to be PROTECTED by You! Your home is a sanctuary from the world, YOU and YOUR WIFE are allowing the world to come in and destroy the peace and Spirit.

Hard to do? Yes. Smart to do? Yes. Will you be glad you did it? yes. Remember she is responsible for her free agency. YOU are responsible for yours. Your younger kids can't control what goes on in your home but you can. Protect them!

[georgia2]

Oh, and you should not be paying for he school! Studies and research SHOW THAT kids do better, make better grades, WHEN THEY PAY FOR IT THEMSELVES!

and when they have to have a part time job to pay for it, EVEN BETTER GRADES!
Listen to Suzie Orman! She has more time to pay back student loans than you have to build for your retirement. She won't be as anxious to throw away her own money.

[theBUBBAMANcan]

Thanks Georgia2...I agree with both postings! An immediate sense of peace has been restored to my home since she left.

Ashley is angry right now, but underneath she knows she has been the cause of her own misery. She CHOSE not to do her college work and she CHOSE to waste her time partying. I simply responded by CHOSING to get some control back of the household that our little kids have to live in.