IVF (in vitro fertilization)

[clevermoniker]

Originally Posted by Eowyn

This is one of the most infuriatingly insensitive things you can say to someone struggling with infertility. There's only one worse thing that someone said to me, and I don't even want to repeat that here.

As one who is currently struggling with infertility, going on two years of trying/treatments/etc. I have to disagree with you. The fact of the matter is, if God really wanted us to procreate, he certainly has the power to make that happen. He is, after all, God. We get to pray for it, and want it, and try, and do all that we can, but in the end, "thy will be done". If you choose to take offense, it's all yours.

[slamjet]

Originally Posted by clevermoniker

This is nothing official, but this is how it the Church's stance on IVF was explained to me, and it made sense. Basically, if God wanted a couple to be able to have children on their own, he would have made them capable of doing that. God helps those who help themselves, so when there are certain medical conditions that make IVF necessary using the couples own sperm and egg, that seems fine too. But once you go beyond that, it just doesn't make any sense. You can't have kids of your own, and God will help you to come to terms with that. There are SO MANY children out there in the world who are just waiting to be adopted... little children who really need your help. You can still raise the child, still have an amazing impact on their life. Refusing to offer them this gift that you are fully capable of giving, just because you didn't get to carry them and give birth... seems a little selfish.

As it has been said, the church STRONGLY discourages, but leaves the decision up to the couple. There will be exceptions to this. But for the vast majority of cases, adoption is the option that should be chosen.

If the Lord wanted me to be healthy, he wouldn't have given me gene's to be able to easily gain weight.

I really need you to source where the church STRONGLY discourages IVF. And then I would love for you to recite this post verbatim to a mother who is not able to have children. If you sincerely do, well, I guess you would have integrity for sticking with your belief. But this is the exact thing that my ex and I had to deal with. We hated it then, we still hate it now. I'll stop here before I type something that will get me banned.

[clevermoniker]

Originally Posted by slamjet

If the Lord wanted me to be healthy, he wouldn't have given me gene's to be able to easily gain weight.

I really need you to source where the church STRONGLY discourages IVF. And then I would love for you to recite this post verbatim to a mother who is not able to have children. If you sincerely do, well, I guess you would have integrity for sticking with your belief. But this is the exact thing that my ex and I had to deal with. We hated it then, we still hate it now. I'll stop here before I type something that will get me banned.

The church STRONGLY discourages IVF when the mother and fathers sperm and egg cannot be used. Someone quoted it earlier in the thread, I'm sure you can find it.

And before you get too settled on your sanctimonious high horse, I *AM* dealing with this RIGHT NOW, at this very moment. If it were God's will, my wife and I would have a child already. If it is God's will, we will eventually be able to have a child. All that is left is for me to continue to do all that I can, and put my faith in Him.

Perhaps God gave you genes to easily gain weight in order for you to learn self control? We all have our struggles in life, and cannot always understand His plan for us.

[slamjet]

I'm sorry you're both going through this. It's not an easy thing to look at your wife and try to explain to her that she is still a wonderful and whole woman to you. I know all about holding a crying wife after church and being around all those folks who have children.

I would advise that blanket comments always invite misunderstandings.

[pam]

Okay everyone..walk away from the thread...walk away from the thread.

This is an extremely sensitive subject. Especially for those that have had to deal with infertility. Ultimately it's left to the decision of the couple involved. So let's try and be respectful of feelings on this because of the sensitivity.

[slamjet]

Originally Posted by pam

Okay everyone..walk away from the thread...walk away from the thread.

I guess I said enough. I'm walking.

[carlimac]

Originally Posted by annewandering

I think any one who is willing to parent a child no matter how it was conceived is ok in my book. If God doesnt want it to be done then it wont happen. Period.
And for the record I would surrogate a baby for my sister, if I had one, in a sec. In cases where the mom or dad has no item to contribute to the baby then an outsider helping through iVF sounds great to me.
Babies are such a blessing it's wonderful to be able to have them no matter how scientifically it has to be done. Thank you, God, for making these ways possible!

My sentiments exactly.

[Eowyn]

Sometimes when we hear God saying "No", what He's really saying is "not yet" or "not like this". Because what you've done so far hasn't worked, doesn't mean He doesn't want to give you this blessing. It just means the right time and the right method haven't synced up yet. I think that very, very rarely is the answer "You aren't supposed to have kids". The only time I've actually seen someone come to that, they weren't doing everything required to see the process through. Faith, doing what we can, having patience, being kind to yourselves and to each other. . . these are all hard but necessary parts of the process. But I hope you'll consider that there's another answer besides "it's not His will".

[annewandering]

I think that if God didnt want any one to have babies by IVF then He wouldnt let them attach. Or He wouldnt let us figure out a way to help them attach or He wouldnt help us figure out how to find a different way.
In other words He gave us brains to use to solve problems and this is a great example of how mankind has figured out how to get around serious road barriers to help couples have babies.
This is something mankind has figured out to HELP couples. Now if we could redirect more funds to helpful things wouldnt the world be a wonderful place?

[Blackmarch]

Originally Posted by carlimac

I'm getting hung up on something. I just found out (despite having many Catholic friends) that the Catholic church forbids IVF. In talking with a couple of Catholic friends, the reasoning for this sounds weak and opinionated to me. Not doctrinal or "biblical". They suggest it weakens marital relations, masturbation necessary to obtain the sperm is forbidden, it destroys the sanctity of life and the way God intended for babies to be conceived, etc.

Is there anything in the scriptures or within the doctrine of the LDS church that would forbid IVF? I have some good friends who conceived triplets this way after many many years of infertility. These children were such a blessing. Later they conceived one more child on their own. There is no difference as far as I can tell in the amount of love they have for any of their children. All their children are treasured and valued. The couple's marriage is strong. He is in the bishopric, she's Primary president and they are without a doubt some of the most devoted and wise parents I've ever met.

In trying to explain my own views to my Catholic friends I get so much dismissal of all the good that comes from this medical technology. They call it "intrinsically evil". They say that as in rape, God can still intervene with something good (a baby) even though the act that brought it about is evil.

I can't see any reason not to if the donor was the husband, and that this was pretty much the last method available to have kids... however if it's from another person then is it any different from having sex outside of marriage for the sake of having children?