"Second coming"?

[Misshalfway]

Joseph Smith is not the Lord God when I last checked.

Then why do you expect that Joseph would have a more refined response that even the Lord. He was a mortal and experienced emotion and indignation like the rest of us. And Joseph had every right to be angry. His people were murdered and persecuted. The US armies were coming after them and even the President of the US wouldn't help them. Heck, you'd be mad too.

[Aesa]

He was a mortal and experienced emotion and indignation like the rest of us. And Joseph had every right to be angry. His people were murdered and persecuted. The US armies were coming after them and even the President of the US wouldn't help them. Heck, you'd be mad too.

You have quite a point. There's just this inkling, that those who are saved would be fine with dying. As one of the apostles (forget which one) said "Where has the sting of death gone?"
The U.S., didn't stay a constitutional republic for long, did it? :P Otherwise, the Pres. would have helped.

[Misshalfway]

Well, the fact is that the president didn't help because he didn't want to lose the vote in Missouri. It was political selfishness that stayed his hand, among other things.

You know I find these conversations interesting. Our critics are so quick to find fault with Joseph and his human-ness, yet find arrogance in his assertions that Jesus would speak to him and even misunderstand by assuming we worship him. It is such a ironic contradiction.

[Aesa]

I don't believe you worship him.
The Joseph is not God comment was not meant to insinuate that, I apologise if it did.
I have read quite a bit of the book of mormon, so I wouldn't consider myself an unkowing outsider.
I've also read the gospel principles.

[KristofferUmfrey]

Originally Posted by Aesa

Why does everyone always assume you're "bashing" beliefs when your critically question them?

I would agree with you BenRaines, but lets remember the Lord's anger is righteous. Joseph Smith is not the Lord God when I last checked.

This goes along the lines of the ridiculous notion that God loves everybody. I agree with you, He does hate.

"Jacob I have loved, Esau have I hated..."

"For God so loved the world, that whosever believeth in Him, shall not perish but have everlasting life..."

God became a man 2,000 years ago so that he could save the lost -- not uphold those who already think they're righteous.



I'm aware of all those, what's your contention here? Where is Stephen in the Bible -- that's the only thing I'm not clear on here...

My contention? Are you chosing not to see it?

So it's ok if Jesus appeared to Saul and John AFTER His acension into heaven, but it's NOT alright that He appeared to Joseph Smith???

*cough*hypocrisy*cough*

[Aesa]

But he didn't appear, it was a vision, speaking of Joseph.

vi⋅sion /ˈvɪʒən/
–noun an experience in which a personage, thing, or event appears vividly or credibly to the mind, although not actually present, often under the influence of a divine or other agency: a heavenly messenger appearing in a vision.

[Elgama]

Originally Posted by Aesa

But he didn't appear, it was a vision.

Yeah and he appeared to Joseph Smith in a vision. why it is referred to by Latter Day Saints as the First Vision. So where is the double standard?

-Charley

[Misshalfway]

Originally Posted by Aesa

But he didn't appear, it was a vision, speaking of Joseph.

Semantics.

[Aesa]

Sorry, I just made my post my clear.

There is just a problem with this whole vision.
What about the divering stories?

[BenRaines]

Asea, instead of me assuming I asked you a question so I would not have to assume. These are questions often asked by those who wish to attack the LDS faith. These are not new questions or concerns but the same rehashed questions asked at least once a week here and asked for years.

If it were so obvious I guess we would have been found out and totally discredited and people would flee by the hundreds of thousands if not millions.

And the caravan moved on.

Ben Raines