Appearance of Evil?

[bmy-]

Originally Posted by lilered

And your expectations are by posting here?

To discuss and share opinions. Does it even matter?

To the OP.. the "appearance of evil" is in the eye of the beholder. It might not look evil to me.. for example.. but it might look evil to lilered. I've got no problems hanging out in a bar or around people who are drinking -- it's culture. With all the examples of discrimination against LDS in the past.. I hope that the current LDS members will keep in mind that they believe is wrong is not universal.. and that the overwhelming majority of the time the people hanging out in the bar are pretty good people.

I'm not going to stand out in the middle of a road.. but i'll cross it if there's something on the other side that I want.

Originally Posted by BenRaines

Feeling a little sarcastic here but I guess I missed out on the nice guys that appeared evil.

I don't think he means appearing "evil".. moreso appearing "rough around the edges". I've had people lock their car doors when I walk by because i'm scruffy and wear a beanie.. when i'm not wearing it they don't lock their doors. I'm the same person.. alot of the guys I know who have tattoos all over their body are way nice and interesting to say the least.. but their appearance scares people.

[prisonchaplain]

"Avoiding the appearance of evil," is a phrase that is based upon the biblical counsel, "Don't be a stumbling block." The context was that strong members should be aware of the weaker ones. In the early church, much of the meat sold in markets came from pagan temples. Those who had converted out of Paganism were still sensitive about the spiritual darkness, and probably believed that the meat invited evil. Of course the Jewish Christians thought, "Meat is meat--those phony gods have no power at all." The Apostle Paul's counsel was that perhaps it might be good to avoid eating meat that was clearly from pagan sources, out of concern for those who were sensitive about it.

As a modern example, people in my church mostly don't drink at all (I'm Assemblies of God, not LDS). When I discussed this in an adult Bible study, the arguments against it were not biblical, but personal, and painful. Alcohol meant abuse and early death for someone in most of the families represented there. So, when someone asks me, "Does the Bible condemn all alcohol?" my answer is, "Perhaps not...but in our society, and in our church, we do well to abstain, so as not to be a stumbling block."

There are good, godly, powerful Christians who drink moderately. But, in American society (the one I know), I would contend they would be better, more godly, and more powerful if they abstained.

[hordak]

Originally Posted by bmy-

I don't think he means appearing "evil".. moreso appearing "rough around the edges". I've had people lock their car doors when I walk by because i'm scruffy and wear a beanie..

I would too



You're far too old to wear a propeller on your head. It's creepy if you ask me.

[Jenamarie]

Huh, I guess I always interpreted the "appearance of evil" thing differently. I've always thought it meant "don't look like a hypocrite". If everyone knows you don't drink for religious reasons, and they find you in a bar with a drink in your hands that could easily be an alcoholic drink (like a "virgin" margarita) they may very well think you're a huge hypocrite, and you'd lose credibility in their eyes. It could make them less receptive to the gospel message if they see LDS people "appearing evil" (or appearing to do things that the church has loudly proclaimed to be "evil").

[sjdean]

Again some more interesting replies.

Jenamarie, the idea about a "virgin margharita". It's kind of like why drink a non alcoholic beer unless actually you really do yearn for a beer.

But I did like bmy's comment, quite simply "it's culture".

A lovely demonstration about the differences between culture and how alcohol is OK in some communities and not in others and the very idea of going to a bar will be either ridiculed or allowed depending on that community.

Here's something I was working on earlier. My post was so not about alcohol and its benefits. My post was really about understanding what the LDS mean when they talk about avoidance. But Im really uncomfortable with "appearance" because we should all know, apperance can be deceptive.

If we only take one persons or one particular groups perception of something, then we're not getting the full picture and may be missing out on so much more.

I like Heavenguards comments. I don't know how the Mormons feel, but I would love to see Mormons in a bar with their non-Mormon friends, perhaps drinking coke or orange juice. The idea that the only thing you can do in a bar is drink alcohol is kind of an alien concept to me, and I don't get it.

I would love Mormons to go to bars, they don't have to be trying to spread the gospel, but they could just be there as friends, discussing the world, politics, religion, helping. I could ask questions, and maybe even make some true Mormon friends.

Any causes I believe in (and I think religion would be a big cause), I try to spread my message to as many people in as many places as I can. I can't imagine actually limiting myself to that great a degree, because I limit my reach, my understanding of others, and the chances I can perhaps be supportive or helpful of others.

[Moksha]

I think the avoiding the appearance of evil involves not drinking anything brown or amber, not going anyplace you would not want to have your Bishop spot you at and to havng full transparency in your financial dealings.

If I missed some items, feel free to add them.

[ruthiechan]

Unfortunately most bars don't just have drinking, they have smoking unless there are laws against that sort of thing. Waitresses tend to be a bit more scantily clad and the people can be quite crude in their language and mannerisms. Also, waitresses tend to ignore you if all you want is water.

I have been in restaurants with family and friends who were not Mormon, and would order a drink. That's their choice and it doesn't bother me. Seeing my friends drunk does bother me. They are not themselves. They do not have full control of their faculties. I don't care to spend time with drunks.

I live in California. I've been to JJ's Blues, a little bar. I really enjoyed the blues music that's played there, live. One waitress always makes sure my, and my husband's, water is full. Another will completely ignore us after getting us water once. The former got a $5 tip, the other got a measly dollar as way of saying, "you should've paid more attention to us."

For me, the smoking is the biggest problem, though there didn't seem to be one at JJ's. I believe there was a separate area for that, but I'm not sure. Anyway, there is no safe level of ingesting second hand smoke. No amount of second hand smoke is safe to breathe! Why would I want to go into a bar when people are slowly killing themselves,and those around them, with little feel good cancer sticks? No thanks.

[ruthiechan]

Originally Posted by Moksha

I think the avoiding the appearance of evil involves not drinking anything brown or amber, not going anyplace you would not want to have your Bishop spot you at and to havng full transparency in your financial dealings.

If I missed some items, feel free to add them.

Darn, there goes my dark chocolate milk. ::cries::

[Snow]

Originally Posted by sjdean

I drink because I enjoy it. I don't drink... to alter my surroundings, my personality, give me confidence or to de-stress.

[/QUOTE]

Sure and I'd like to sell you my 14% share in Fort Knox for 180 cash money if you can get it to me before midnight.


The SINGULAR raison d'être for alcohol is its mind altering properties. Take away it's mind altering properties and alcohol sales would plummet to Microsoft Zune levels, no matter how good you think it tastes.

If you are going to try and put one over on us, you'll have to be much more creative than that.

[Snow]

Originally Posted by Moksha

I think the avoiding the appearance of evil involves not drinking anything brown or amber, not going anyplace you would not want to have your Bishop spot you at and to havng full transparency in your financial dealings.

If I missed some items, feel free to add them.

Personally, my sense of self worth is not so pitiful that I care one bit what some self-righteous twit perceives of my moral character due to "appearances." What matters to me if whether or not I am moral, not whether I appear so.