Changes to John 3:16 - Page 2

prisonchaplain · #11 (**permalink**) 10-20-2009, 11:47 AM

It sounds to me like someone conflated John 3:16 with the LDS teaching that true conversion includes accepting what God's done and then doing "all that you can." I doubt it was an intentional reworking of the scripture, but more a matter of combining two teachings.

ozzy · #12 (**permalink**) 10-21-2009, 08:54 PM

I agree with prisonchaplain. It sounds as though the person who rephrased John 3:16 was using it in a teaching and combined it somewhat with James 2:17-20, which speak of faith requiring works.

Snow · #13 (**permalink**) 10-21-2009, 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lattelady

Hemidakota, I can't find it--where exactly do I go? Sorry, I'm a little slow.

But I want to find it--I hope people don't think I've just made this up --I really did see it, but I should've written it down at the time.

Was it before or after you saw the Loch Ness Monster on a double-date with Elvis and the Gabor twins?

Traveler · #14 (**permalink**) 10-21-2009, 10:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lattelady

Hi Pam. I grew up being taught from and using the King James Version. I still use it, but also use the New International Version and sometimes New American Standard. The original verse says, "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish but have everlasting life."
The one I saw recently, and I'm not sure where to find it again--but I'll try, said (and this is not exact, but VERY close), "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son that whosoever believeth in Him and keeps all His laws and commandments, should not perish but have everlasting life."

Is there a difference between believing in the Son Jesus Christ and keeping all His laws and commandments?

How can you believe in someone you do not even know (see 1John 2:3-4)

"3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.

4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him."

What is the point of your question?

The Traveler

lattelady · #15 (**permalink**) 10-21-2009, 11:39 PM

Traveler, the point of my question is: upon seeing the wording of the verse changed, I was bothered. Much the same way, I suppose, as you are bothered with the use of God's name in a way that feels flippant to you. (which is why you treat it with great care, even in the writing of it). I have yet to locate the post where I saw it worded differently, but I know I saw it. I'm sorry I can't yet produce it. I'll do my best to find it. I am bothered by scripture being changed or manipulated. John 3:16 is a verse that is particularly precious to me. To find its wording changed was actually offensive to me. The point of my question, then, was: why would someone feel it is alright to add to scripture?

Snow · #16 (**permalink**) 10-21-2009, 11:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lattelady

Traveler, the point of my question is: upon seeing the wording of the verse changed, I was bothered. Much the same way, I suppose, as you are bothered with the use of God's name in a way that feels flippant to you. (which is why you treat it with great care, even in the writing of it). I have yet to locate the post where I saw it worded differently, but I know I saw it. I'm sorry I can't yet produce it. I'll do my best to find it. I am bothered by scripture being changed or manipulated. John 3:16 is a verse that is particularly precious to me. To find its wording changed was actually offensive to me. The point of my question, then, was: why would someone feel it is alright to add to scripture?

Now that makes me curious... are you likewise bothered by falsified scripture, ie, the long ending of Mark, the story of the woman taken in adultery or the fraudulent Johannine Comma (1 John 5:7-8 re the Trinity) all of which are late falsifications to scripture?

... and the post you say you saw - was it a deliberate falsification of the scripture (like the above examples) meant to make you think that it was real - or was it simply a play on scriptural words to make a point?

lattelady · #17 (**permalink**) 10-21-2009, 11:58 PM

I'm not sure if I can take the time to answer you--I just heard the Loch Ness Monster rummaging around in our dumpster and I may need to call animal control...

Traveler · #18 (**permalink**) 10-22-2009, 12:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lattelady

Traveler, the point of my question is: upon seeing the wording of the verse changed, I was bothered. Much the same way, I suppose, as you are bothered with the use of God's name in a way that feels flippant to you. (which is why you treat it with great care, even in the writing of it). I have yet to locate the post where I saw it worded differently, but I know I saw it. I'm sorry I can't yet produce it. I'll do my best to find it. I am bothered by scripture being changed or manipulated. John 3:16 is a verse that is particularly precious to me. To find its wording changed was actually offensive to me. The point of my question, then, was: why would someone feel it is alright to add to scripture?

Thank you for your kind response. I would suggest that it would be for the same reason that someone would justify translating the scriptures into an English version so you could learn of ancient revelation. The extra words clarifies the understanding to someone in our modern society that otherwise could not comprehend the texts in their original. My point is that adding the words in no way changes the meaning and the message that was preserved in the scriptures for our day.

My question still stands – how can someone believe in somebody that they do not even know? The extra words makes the understanding of the scripture so very clear that attempts to play with words to teach false doctrine becomes more difficult. Do you agree?

The Traveler

lattelady · #19 (**permalink**) 10-22-2009, 12:47 AM

Traveler, respectfully, I would have to disagree. The words I saw added "that whosoever believeth in Him AND KEEPS HIS COMMANDMENTS..." change the core teaching of that verse.

Snow · #20 (**permalink**) 10-22-2009, 02:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lattelady

Traveler, respectfully, I would have to disagree. The words I saw added "that whosoever believeth in Him AND KEEPS HIS COMMANDMENTS..." change the core teaching of that verse.

At present, it seems like you are confused - perhaps you are thinking about 1 John: 2:3 And hereby we know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. 2:4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him; 2:5 but whoso keepeth his word, in him verily hath the love of God been perfected.

But I am still curious... are you likewise bothered by falsified scripture, ie, the long ending of Mark, the story of the woman taken in adultery or the fraudulent Johannine Comma (1 John 5:7-8 re the Trinity) all of which are late falsifications to scripture?