The Veil...

[ConnieM]

I talked with an investigator and the missionaries about the plan of our Heavenly Father and thought about it.

I think the plan of our Father is not only wonderful and fascinating it also is very logical in many ways.

I'd like to find out more about the veil and wondered if anyone of you studied this topic and/or can help me to learn more.

Why exactly do we need the veil?
Who will finally experience the veil to be taken off?
And when will this happen?

[pam]

LDS.org - Liahona Article - The Value of the Veil

[ConnieM]

Thanks for the link. I will read it...

[Justice]

Very good topic, Connie.

And, thanks for posting that article, Pam. Here is a clip from it:

Our mortal existence gives us the opportunity to develop the skills, capacities, and divine attributes we must have to live in the celestial kingdom. When my nine-year-old boy says he wants to drive the car, I must explain to him that if he goes out onto the freeway, he is going to be dangerous. He might kill himself and a lot of other people as well. He does not yet have the capacity to use the freedom offered by a freeway.

Until he develops that capacity—the skill, the judgement, the maturity—driving on the freeway will kill him. The same would be true of our premature introduction to the freedom—and the responsibility—of living in a kingdom governed by celestial laws.

Responsibility can liberate us or crush us, depending upon how prepared we are to receive it.

Very profound statement.

And, I think he addresses a topic that can roughly be described as "faith and leanring by study or experience" (a topic we frequently debate about on this forum).

The idea that salvation involves a process of skill development may also help us to understand why there is a veil. We need not be impatient that things must be the way they are; we should, rather, be grateful. These circumstances show us how faith and repentance and knowing God are processes and principles of action. We understand these processes and principles not just by defining them, but also by experiencing them. God is a great teacher, and he knows the patterns and the principles we must follow in order to develop divine capacities. He can teach us these things—he has that power—but only if we will give ourselves to the process.

If we insist on getting a medal or an award as proof that we are learning the right things, or if we insist on being able to explain to everyone else how the gospel works and why it works—even though God himself cannot explain it to our finite minds until we have developed the capacity to understand it—we will not have learned what the gospel of Jesus Christ is about. We will still be floundering around as spiritual adolescents trying to master the details of a lesser law.

I very much enjoyed the article.

Your questions were:

Why exactly do we need the veil?

I like to think of it this way. For those who gain exaltation, one day they will "move out" of their heavenly home and start a family of their own. This mortal life provides that opportunity on a very limited scale in order for you to prove you will give yourself to your children, and that you will choose to grant them agency and provide a method for them to become exalted... namely the same way Heavenly Father did it, by creating an earth and providing redemption from mortality... or by choosing Jesus Christ.

Who will finally experience the veil to be taken off?

The Book of Mormon makes it clear that some will. Obviously, it will be those who have matured far enough in their relationship with Christ that they will be able to handle what's behind the veil. It is more a result of who God will choose and not so much who will be worthy enough, though... at least in my opinion.

And when will this happen?

Hopefully sooner as opposed to later. I'd love to get more of the Nephite and Jaredite writings, and some of what's on the Brass Plates. But, I haven't studied the topic enough to even have a guess as to about when this is suppose to happen.

[ConnieM]

I like the article. I have to say that I still have questions about this topic. Oh, I don't mean that I have doubts... I'm just curious!

Bruce C. Hafen explained:

A) The veil does two things:

1) It keeps us from remembering our premortal past.
2) It keeps God, his angels, and their activities hidden from our sight.

This is clear. But I have a question. Do only human beings have a veil or does every living thing? We know for example that the earth was born out of water, baptized and received the Holy Spirit, will burn and die and resurrect and be perfected. Would you say that the earth has a veil? I would guess so. And I would furthermore guess that Nr 1) describes the task of the veil every human has whereas Nr 2) could describe what the veil of this earth creates.

There is a veil between our world of mortality and God’s world of the eternities. It can become very thin at times.

B )

“And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead” (Luke 16:29–31).

This is interesting. It says:
a) If they won't listen to the prophets here on earth,
b) they also would not believe if they actually would be allowed to see.

Believing is such a fantastic topic. Well, it does not make a difference to the people who don't believe whether they see or don't because it would not change their state of belief. This means it only makes a difference to the believers.

C ) I also think that it is interesting why we have to learn by experience. I know we have to in order to undertand and progress. Bruce C. Hafen said the Lord Jesus Himself had to learn by experience. I think we can learn a lot of theory without experience but we can hardly learn to use this theory if we don't try it. And since our goal is not only theoretic but very much concentrating on action (creating lives and worlds...) we need to prepare for it by experience.

D)

Why might we be “damned” or stopped if the veil were parted too early?

Wow, never thought of this before.