Agency

[Justice]

What is agency, exactly?

When do you have it?

I'm going to pull from some documents on the topic I've made over the years.

There are only 6 scriptures that use the word agency, but many others teach the concept with other words (like dominion). First I'll post 5 of the scriptures that directly use the word agency (please read them and as much of the surrounding verses as necessary to get an idea of what's being said):

D&C 29:
36 And it came to pass that Adam, being tempted of the devil—for, behold, the devil was before Adam, for he rebelled against me, saying, Give me thine honor, which is my power; and also a third part of the hosts of heaven turned he away from me because of their agency;

D&C 93:
31 Behold, here is the agency of man, and here is the condemnation of man; because that which was from the beginning is plainly manifest unto them, and they receive not the light.

D&C 101:
78 That every man may act in doctrine and principle pertaining to futurity, according to the moral agency which I have given unto him, that every man may be accountable for his own sins in the day of judgment.

Moses 4:
3 Wherefore, because that Satan rebelled against me, and sought to destroy the agency of man, which I, the Lord God, had given him, and also, that I should give unto him mine own power; by the power of mine Only Begotten, I caused that he should be cast down;

Moses 7:
32 The Lord said unto Enoch: Behold these thy brethren; they are the workmanship of mine own hands, and I gave unto them their knowledge, in the day I created them; and in the Garden of Eden, gave I unto man his agency;

The one I left out really doesn't pertain to this discussion as it was directed at one individual.

One thing that I'd like to point out is that agency is not the same for all. For instance, someone in prison does not have the same agency as someone who is not. It's a difficult discussion to reach any agreement on until you set some definitions. It seems when the General Authorities teach or discuss agency, or the general ability to choose given to man, they say "moral agency" and not just agency (as pointed out in D&C 101).

This makes it easier to discuss agency. Moral agency covers a man's given ability to choose how moral he will be, or whether or not he will obey law. He does not have to have all laws and commandments available in order to exercise his moral agency.

Adam was given a choice between 2 things in the Garden, and exercised his agency to choose one. However, since there was not a third option, he did not have agency to choose that 3rd thing. We can only be held accountable for the choices we makes against what choices are available.

Thoughts?

Another thought to the astute reader: we see a seeming contradiction between D&C 29:36 and Moses 7:32... anyone see it? Any thoughts about the seeming contradiction?

[bytor2112]

Another thought to the astute reader: we see a seeming contradiction between D&C 29:36 and Moses 7:32... anyone see it? Any thoughts about the seeming contradiction?

I am guessing...because in the pre-existence we were spirits and not yet MAN?

[Vanhin]

Originally Posted by Justice

D&C 29:
36 And it came to pass that Adam, being tempted of the devil—for, behold, the devil was before Adam, for he rebelled against me, saying, Give me thine honor, which is my power; and also a third part of the hosts of heaven turned he away from me because of their agency;

Moses 7:
32 The Lord said unto Enoch: Behold these thy brethren; they are the workmanship of mine own hands, and I gave unto them their knowledge, in the day I created them; and in the Garden of Eden, gave I unto man his agency;

Another thought to the astute reader: we see a seeming contradiction between D&C 29:36 and Moses 7:32... anyone see it? Any thoughts about the seeming contradiction?

I think the answer lies in D&C 93.

29 Man was also in the beginning with God. Intelligence, or the light of truth, was not created or made, neither indeed can be.

30 All truth is independent in that sphere in which God has placed it, to act for itself, as all intelligence also; otherwise there is no existence.

31 Behold, here is the agency of man, and here is the condemnation of man; because that which was from the beginning is plainly manifest unto them, and they receive not the light.

32 And every man whose spirit receiveth not the light is under condemnation. (D&C 93:29-32)

Agency is derived from being enlightened by the light of Christ and by being placed into spheres (environments) where we can independently make choices.

In our first estate, we were born innocent, and developed until we were at full stature as spirits. The same life giving Light radiated in us there, and we were faced with choices within that sphere. Obviously, a third of the host of heaven chose to rebel with Satan and were cast out. The rest of us are privileged, because of our agency, to continue our progression by entering mortality, where we were once again "born innocent" into a new sphere of existence.

Every spirit of man was innocent in the beginning; and God having redeemed man from the fall, men became again, in their infant state, innocent before God. (D&C 93:38)

Here in this second estate, we are in a new sphere, where the light of Christ enlightens us manifesting itself as conscience. We are faced with choices, and are allowed to act independently, and therefore have agency.

Regards,
Vanhin

[Vanhin]

But that's not all... Because of our agency, we all inevitably sin, and thus experience spiritual death. Another birth awaits the faithful, where we will be cleansed from our sins - innocent again before God, quickened in the inner man. Our father Adam was the first to experience this rebirth, as he was redeemed from the fall.

That by reason of transgression cometh the fall, which fall bringeth death, and inasmuch as ye were born into the world by water, and blood, and the spirit, which I have made, and so became of dust a living soul, even so ye must be born again into the kingdom of heaven, of water, and of the Spirit, and be cleansed by blood, even the blood of mine Only Begotten; that ye might be sanctified from all sin, and enjoy the words of eternal life in this world, and eternal life in the world to come, even immortal glory; For by the water ye keep the commandment; by the Spirit ye are justified, and by the blood ye are sanctified; (Moses 6:59-60)

And again, our accountability as free agents increases, after we are "born again".

For of him unto whom much is given much is required; and he who sins against the greater light shall receive the greater condemnation. (D&C 82:3)

Regards,
Vanhin

[Webster]

It seems odd that, "Agency is derived from being enlightened by the light of Christ," and that, "Because of our agency, we all inevitably sin." The two statements taken together seem a little problematic.

[Vanhin]

Originally Posted by Webster

It seems odd that, "Agency is derived from being enlightened by the light of Christ," and that, "Because of our agency, we all inevitably sin." The two statements taken together seem a little problematic.

Well you left out the statement in it's entirety.

"Agency is derived from being enlightened by the light of Christ and by being placed into spheres (environments) where we can independently make choices."

What I mean is "in mortality" we all sin and fall short of the glory of God.

But in any case how are they problematic? You didn't provide me with any explanation to respond to.

Regards,
Vanhin

[Justice]

This is going to seem like an odd direction to go on this subject, but I want to make a point before I try to explain.

Did Jesus really walk on water?

Vanhin, As a note of interest, you and bytor have the same answer (accorind to my understanding)... you just chose different methods of saying it. You, obviously, have a more thorough description, but aren't you basically saying what bytor is saying?

And, did you say we were born as spirits just to make me happy?

One last thought on your comments, do you mean "light of Christ" or "light of truth," or do you use the 2 terms synonomously?

[applepansy]

Originally Posted by Justice

What is agency, exactly?

From lds.org: Agency is the ability and privilege God gives us to choose and to act for ourselves.

When do you have it?

Also from lds.org: God's children have power to choose; they had this ability even before they were born.


It was easier to copy and paste than use my foggy brain today....sorry

One thing that I'd like to point out is that agency is not the same for all. For instance, someone in prison does not have the same agency as someone who is not.

lds.org quoted again: In this life, people continue to have agency; even if their personal freedoms are restricted or taken away, they can choose how to feel and react.

As we make choices in life, bad choices bring fewer choices next time and good choices bring more choices. So someone in prison still chose himself right into the situation and through his agency he can choose himself out.

Moral agency covers a man's given ability to choose how moral he will be, or whether or not he will obey law. He does not have to have all laws and commandments available in order to exercise his moral agency.

Agreed

Thoughts?

My oldest son taught me a lot about agency and while as a parent I tried to restrict his choices to hurt himself in the end I didn't have that power. Agency is God-given and no matter how hard we try we cannot infringe on it.... inflluence? maybe... but not infringe.


Boyd K. Packer, Ensign, May 1988, 69–72
Ever and always [the Atonement] offers amnesty from transgression and from death if we will but repent. . . . Repentance is the key with which we can unlock the prison from inside . . . , and agency is ours to use it.

[Webster]

Originally Posted by Webster

It seems odd that, "Agency is derived from being enlightened by the light of Christ," and that, "Because of our agency, we all inevitably sin." The two statements taken together seem a little problematic.

It almost sounds like that which we gain from being enlighted by the Light of Christ (a good thing), is that which causes us to sin (a bad thing). Maybe it would help if I said it's a bit paradoxical rather than problematic. If you still can't see it, don't worry about it.

[Vanhin]

Originally Posted by Justice

Vanhin, As a note of interest, you and bytor have the same answer (accorind to my understanding)... you just chose different methods of saying it. You, obviously, have a more thorough description, but aren't you basically saying what bytor is saying?

Yes, we are saying the same thing. Two different spheres of existence, each with opportunities to progress through the use of agency.

And, did you say we were born as spirits just to make me happy?

Well, I want you to be happy, yes, but I said it because I believe it.

One last thought on your comments, do you mean "light of Christ" or "light of truth," or do you use the 2 terms synonomously?

They are synonyms to me. Also, the term intelligence can be used synonymously with the light of Christ. For example, in an all time favorite article of mine, President boyd K. Packer, of the Twelve, makes the following statement.

The Light of Christ existed in you before you were born (see D&C 93:23, 29–30), and it will be with you every moment that you live and will not perish when the mortal part of you has turned to dust. It is ever there. (LDS.org - Liahona Article - The Light of Christ)

Notice the scriptural reference he uses to back up his statement - D&C 93:23, 29-30 which are the scriptures I am referencing.

I also think that some of these terms have more than one meaning. Take intelligence(s), for example. The Guide to the Scriptures has this definition.

Intelligence has several meanings, three of which are:1 It is the light of truth which gives life and light to all things in the universe. It has always existed.2 The word intelligences may also refer to spirit children of God.3 The scriptures also may speak of intelligence as referring to the spirit element that existed before we were begotten as spirit children. (Guide to the Scriptures: Intelligence, Intelligences)

For many of you who are familiar with my ramblings out here, that is an oft quoted reference by me. I think that it is interesting that the intelligence GS reference says "See also Light, Light of Christ; Spirit; Truth".

I especially think that Pres. Packer's comments are significant to this discussion, since I think that agency is tied to the light of Christ in us. Pres. Packer makes the same observation in his article, but I will just quote the following which shows how it is tied to agency.

Conscience affirms the reality of the Spirit of Christ in man. It affirms, as well, the reality of good and evil, of justice, mercy, honor, courage, faith, love, and virtue, as well as the necessary opposites—hatred, greed, brutality, jealousy (see 2 Ne. 2:11, 16). Such values, though physically intangible, respond to laws with cause-and-effect relationships as certain as any resulting from physical laws (see Gal. 6:7–9). The Spirit of Christ can be likened unto a “guardian angel” for every person. (LDS.org - Liahona Article - The Light of Christ)

Since the light of Christ is the divine influence that allows us to distinguish between good and evil, how can we truly have agency without it? (see LDS.org - Liahona Article - The Unspeakable Gift) also, if we were not placed into situations with opposing choices, how can we have agency? That is why I say both elements, the spirit of Christ, and an environment where we can freely choose between good and evil are necessary for agency to truly exist.

Wherefore, the Lord God gave unto man that he should act for himself. Wherefore, man could not act for himself save it should be that he was enticed by the one or the other. (2 Ne. 2:16)

Regards,
Vanhin