Sealing Powers and Parental salvation?

[grauchy123]

Question for you guys I hope to get an answer on. I am a former devout Mormon (now resigned) and I came from a devout LDS family.

Since leaving the church my parents have expressed that me leaving the church has put an extra level of responsibility on their shoulders. My parents claim that if they are even more righteous now they can invoke the sealing powers of the temple and bring their children into the Celestial Kingdom with them.

It sounds like all that dynastic sealing stuff that went on in early church history. But I haven't heard anyone teach or talk about that stuff in recent days. Is this still a real LDS Doctrine? It just seems really unhealthy because they have taken an extra burden upon themselves and I can see the pressure is killing them. Especially since I'm their second child to leave the church.

I'd like to know if you have any sources to show that this is a false doctrine. If so that would be great I think it would really lift that burden from their shoulders. Then again if it is a real LDS Doctrine that would be good to know also.

[Dravin]

Is this what you are talking about? Look under the heading "What is the fate of the wayward?", Mormonism and culture/Wayward family members - FAIRMormon. Note also there is a link at the end of that section to additional quotes.

[grauchy123]

Originally Posted by Dravin

Is this what you are talking about? Look under the heading "What is the fate of the wayward?", Mormonism and culture/Wayward family members - FAIRMormon. Note also there is a link at the end of that section to additional quotes.

Thanks for the article. I did see one quote there that seems to support my parent's idea.

Originally Posted by Lorenzo Snow

If you succeed in passing through these trials and afflictions and receive a resurrection, you will, by the power of the Priesthood, work and labor, as the Son of God has, until you get all your sons and daughters in the path of exaltation and glory. This is just as sure as that the sun rose this morning over yonder mountains. Therefore, mourn not because all your sons and daughters do not follow in the path that you have marked out to them, or give heed to your counsels. Inasmuch as we succeed in securing eternal glory, and stand as saviors, and as kings and priests to our God, we will save our posterity.

Lorenzo Snow, "Preaching the Gospel in the Spirit World," in Brian H. Stuy (editor), Collected Discourses: Delivered by Wilford Woodruff, his two counselors, the twelve apostles, and others, 1868–1898, 5 vols., (Woodland Hills, Utah: B.H.S. Publishing, 1987–1989), 3:364. [Discourse given on 6 October 1893.]

But that's a pretty obscure reference and I'm sure my parents have never read that. I'm still left wondering where they have gotten this.

[applepansy]

Do you really think that proving this a false doctrine will relieve your parents worry for you and your sibling?

[Dravin]

Originally Posted by grauchy123

But that's a pretty obscure reference and I'm sure my parents have never read that. I'm still left wondering where they have gotten this.

Keep in mind that conference talks can make some fairly obscure references. With that thought in mind the source given in the article is what the authors are choosing to source it to and not the only way one could come across such a quote. For instance with the King Follet discourse, I could source someone's journal of it, or maybe a scholarly work, or I could source the recent Teachings of the Presidents of the Church: Joseph Smith for certain segments of it. If I sourced the journal or scholarly work it would be by all appearances a very obscure reference but you'd be missing that parts of it made it into the official Church curriculum a few years ago.

The only way to know just what reference your parents have personally encoutered is to use the radical tactic known as: asking them. Of course they may not be familiar with a specific reference. I'm vaguely familiar with the doctrine in question, I've heard the idea before, but I don't know if it was in official curriculum, in a conference talk, some comment in Gospel Doctrine, or from my parents.

[grauchy123]

Originally Posted by applepansy

Do you really think that proving this a false doctrine will relieve your parents worry for you and your sibling?

Is it healthy for them to think that they now carry the burden and stress themselves out? I honestly don't know which is better. Besides I'm still not clear on if it even is a false doctrine. Do you have any input?

[Dravin]

Here we go, a (relatively) recent conference address:

Originally Posted by President James E. Faust

“The Prophet Joseph Smith declared—and he never taught more comforting doctrine—that the eternal sealings of faithful parents and the divine promises made to them for valiant service in the Cause of Truth, would save not only themselves, but likewise their posterity. Though some of the sheep may wander, the eye of the Shepherd is upon them, and sooner or later they will feel the tentacles of Divine Providence reaching out after them and drawing them back to the fold. Either in this life or the life to come, they will return. They will have to pay their debt to justice; they will suffer for their sins; and may tread a thorny path; but if it leads them at last, like the penitent Prodigal, to a loving and forgiving father’s heart and home, the painful experience will not have been in vain. Pray for your careless and disobedient children; hold on to them with your faith. Hope on, trust on, till you see the salvation of God.” 8

A principle in this statement that is often overlooked is that they must fully repent and “suffer for their sins” and “pay their debt to justice.” I recognize that now is the time “to prepare to meet God.” 9 If the repentance of the wayward children does not happen in this life, is it still possible for the cords of the sealing to be strong enough for them yet to work out their repentance? In the Doctrine and Covenants we are told, “The dead who repent will be redeemed, through obedience to the ordinances of the house of God,

“And after they have paid the penalty of their transgressions, and are washed clean, shall receive a reward according to their works, for they are heirs of salvation.” 10

Link: Dear Are the Sheep That Have Wandered - general-conference

[beefche]

Here is a thread that talks about this subject and gives some quotes that I think you are thinking of:

Wayward Children Born under the Covenant

[grauchy123]

Originally Posted by Dravin

The only way to know just what reference your parents have personally encoutered is to use the radical tactic known as: asking them. Of course they may not be familiar with a specific reference. I'm vaguely familiar with the doctrine in question, I've heard the idea before, but I don't know if it was in official curriculum, in a conference talk, some comment in Gospel Doctrine, or from my parents.

I did that when we had the discussion but they didn't know. They aren't the type to have source references on hand. They just know it. That's why I've come here to ask where you guys think they might have gotten this teaching from.

My parents are in their mid 60s if you think that might be important.

[Dravin]

Originally Posted by grauchy123

I did that when we had the discussion but they didn't know. They aren't the type to have source references on hand. They just know it. That's why I've come here to ask where you guys think they might have gotten this teaching from.

My parents are in their mid 60s if you think that might be important.

Well if they can't remember then no definitive answer of where they heard it is possible. We can just supply likely candidates and references. As I noted above, I've got a conference reference from 2003. Should be contemporary enough. Beefche's link is replete with reference, I know that some of them are things like the Journal of Discourses, but they get quoted enough by manuals and members alike that I wouldn't discount them as valid sources for where they heard it.

Of course where they heard it is kind of a tangent isn't it? The real question is in the legitimacy of the doctrine, and by all accounts it is legitimate as far as it goes (I don't know your parents specific understanding). I personally think they are off in thinking they need to be more righteous (than they would need to be if they didn't have wayward children), though that's probably just a linguistic issue. There thinking is probably along the lines that they need to make sure to remain faithful for those promises to be fulfilled and by all appearance such reasoning is not remiss.