"New booklet seeks to reconcile Mormon faith with gay youth"

[Just_A_Guy]

Originally Posted by HEthePrimate

The Church doesn't normally hestitate to apply labels to people. "Wicked" and "apostate" leap to mind.

I'm not aware that people have formed grass-roots campaigns to change Church policy on the grounds that their status as "wicked" or "apostate" should give them a free pass to indulge in otherwise-verbotten behavior.

I very much doubt there are too many people who view their sexuality as their entire identity. Pretty much everybody understands that their sexuality is only a part of who they are.

But there are many view it as an integral part of their identity, to the point that they allege that in rejecting the congregant's sexuality the Church is rejecting the congregant him/herself.

[the Ogre]

Originally Posted by KirtlandSaintinZion

I've haven't felt labeled by the church itself, just individual members.

I agree with this notion with the current leadership of the church. Labeling is much more naughty in our PC world than acting on one's sexuality.

My daughter came out of the closet the day my oldest son went into the MTC. She was so angry he would go on a mission when the church, in her opinion, discriminates against the LGBT community.

This was a huge challenge for my son while he was in the MTC and while on his mission because she wrote angry letters to him far more often than I wrote letters at all.

I don't know if the modern church actively discriminates against the LGBT community anymore, but by not fully accepting LGBT members regardless of sexual activity is just as bad (for them).

My daughter and I do not discuss this. She knows what I think: I love her, but will never accept her behavior as appropriate for members of the church. I think she is a great person, but when she came out and has been active in various relationships, I feel she basically turned her back on the church. I feel the same way about my brothers and my uncles who are sexually active outside marriage.

I talk to my daughter anyway. I love her and that can not be denied, I just will never accept her lifestyle as LDS appropriate, but it is just fine for someone who is not trying to live according to church standards. If one is not trying to be LDS, I really don't care what they do.

[annewandering]

If someone says to the church its my way or you are evil then someone has a big bunch of repenting to do. There have been grassroots efforts to change the church. Satan does like to get people who should know better to do his work for him. Anyone who thinks public pressure is going to make God say 'oh sorry! If you want to do it then Yes it has to be A OK!" God leads the church, not deranged apostate members. If you want a church where you can pretend to lead God around by His nose then you have the wrong church.
The church does not discriminate against anyone. The very idea is extremely offensive. Stupid people in the church may do so but not the church. "Hey God stop telling me to repent! Its not nice and hurts my feelings". Yes it does sound stupid and it is. So why do people keep doing it?

[Soulsearcher]

Originally Posted by annewandering

If someone says to the church its my way or you are evil then someone has a big bunch of repenting to do. There have been grassroots efforts to change the church. Satan does like to get people who should know better to do his work for him. Anyone who thinks public pressure is going to make God say 'oh sorry! If you want to do it then Yes it has to be A OK!" God leads the church, not deranged apostate members. If you want a church where you can pretend to lead God around by His nose then you have the wrong church.
The church does not discriminate against anyone. The very idea is extremely offensive. Stupid people in the church may do so but not the church. "Hey God stop telling me to repent! Its not nice and hurts my feelings". Yes it does sound stupid and it is. So why do people keep doing it?

While i understand and respect where you are coming from i do wonder if you see how your first line can be turned around and why it might be viewed as interesting to others. It all comes down to the core beliefs of the person saying it and how each side wants to be appreciated as they say it.

"If someone says to the gays its my way or you are evil then someone has a big bunch of repenting to do."

As said before i have no interest in the church changing it's views, but again tend to look for the same simple "respect"(know there's a better term but i'm tired and it's not coming to mind) that others would like given. The other thing is the line isn't "hey god stop telling me to repent it hurts my feelings" it tends more to be "hey followers of god, i believe different than you please give what you'd like to receive from others" I know and understand why this won't happen and while again i don't quite agree i can respect the stance as it again boils down to peoples core beliefs.

[mtman318]

If I understand correctly, society in general used to view sexuality more in terms of behavior and action, rather than feelings and attraction (at least this was according to my sociology textbook). Eventually this changed, probably around the 60's. For some people however, including me, the old definition is still being used when talking about sin; hence the many misunderstandings that come up. I'm sure some people still think the attraction itself is the sin, but I believe people are becoming more informed in this regard.

[Traveler]

It is quite interesting what many think is a sin and what many think is a condition that need no repentance. Below are some thoughts from LDS theology and from scripture that I believe should be considered.

1. Repentance means among other things as having a “change” of heart. It does not mean to just stop “doing” something. A person that labels themselves or calls themselves using terms that indicate or relate to certain behaviors is not likely to understand this very important principle. For example a person that calls themselves a “child abuser” but claims to have never actually preformed the act of abuse – is not likely to understand what it means to have a change of heart.

2. Jesus said, “As a man thinks in his heart, so is he. Obviously no one knows what others are thinking in their heart. This statement was not made so that there is a means to condemn others but rather so we can understand both the danger of entertaining certain “thoughts” and the importance of understanding one’s self and using the power (freedom) to master or discipline ourselves. For example there is a very big difference between an alcoholic and a recovering alcoholic. It is not just about drinking alcohol but also who you chose to associate with and the circumstances you choose to put yourself in and the things you fanaticize yourself doing.

3. Jesus also said that “to look upon another and to lust after them – one has already committed adultery in their heart.” Again like #2 this is not a means by which we can make a determination about someone else. This is a guide or warning sign by which we can see ourselves as G-d sees us. And even from such a perspective it is not so we can learn to hate ourselves but that we may be warned that to continue as we are – allowing certain attractions will only take us places that will bring ourselves and others to that which will cause harm, pain and suffering.

President McKay said something like, “We cannot determine if a bird flies over us but we can prevent that bird from nesting on our head.” Each of us will contribute to our destiny – that is our choice. None of us are slaves, by birth, to anything – the greatest doctrine, in my mind, concerning LDS theology is that we have the power given us by G-d, to determine what we will be. I believe that anyone or anything that intends to diminish or limit that power within us is our enemy and anyone or anything that support and encourages us to that end is our friend.

The Traveler