I hereby humbly submit to whatever the will of God proves to be

[peteolcott]

I think that (at least aspects of) the true will of God can be reverse-engineered from the single criterion measure of the success of the Master Plan: Maximize Joy.

If we diligently seek these aspects, the Holy Spirit will most effectively fill in the missing details. Test this and see if it rings true or false.

I will trust anything said that was spiritually discerned. I am striving for more humility, please be patient with me.

This bears repeating: I hereby humbly submit to the will of God.

[Dove]

Hi, Peteolcott;

How would you propose "maximizing ones' joy" in this life? What would you do to do this?

From my perspective and in my opinion....there is a reason the scripture quote that "men are that they might have joy" is ensconced in the chapter on opposition in the Book of Mormon...2 Nephi 2....I believe there is a difference between "joy" and being happy or having fun. Imo, true joy can only be experienced during or after experiencing it's opposite, which is generally pain, sorrow, suffering, etc. I strongly believe there is a point to suffering on this earth. Please don't misunderstand me~I don't advocating self-inflicted suffering. My experience has been that life will most certainly bring these aspects to our door, whether we're wanting them to come or not...

There are a plethora of scriptures in our standard works that relate stories of those who suffered and, in many instances, died because of their choice to be Christian/believers and followers of Christ. And, of course, our first prophet in this dispensation, Joseph Smith, gave his life for his Savior and His restored church. There are also scriptures that address those who are persecuted for His name and the blessings they will be given for their willingness to do so.....One of my favorite scriptures on this is in the Doctrine and Covenants~

"For verily I say unto you, blessed is he that keepeth my commandments, whether in life or in death; and he that is faithful in tribulation, the reward of the same is greater in the kingdom of heaven.

Ye cannot behold with your natural eyes, for the present time, the design of your God concerning those things which shall come hereafter, and the glory which shall follow after much tribulation.

For after much tribulation come the blessings. Wherefore the day cometh that ye shall be crowned with much glory; the hour is not yet, but is nigh at hand." (Doctrine and Covenants 58:2-4)

Admittedly, a lot of people have considered this a "negative" and downer way for me to look at this....But, I would invite you to study all the stories of those who experienced trials and tribulation on their journey back home, in the scriptures. Don't worry, you won't have to go far to find them. Job is a great place to start....

Thanks for starting this post. I admire your desire to "humbly submit to whatever the will of God proves to be." While I don't know what that's going to be for you, I have found that it is of utmost importance in keeping our baptismal/Temple covenants to be true to His will. Sadly, I don't do this very well....When I do better I sure feel the Holy Spirit a lot stronger in my heart and mind....

The best on your journey to do this...
Dove

[peteolcott]

Originally Posted by Dove

Hi, Peteolcott;

How would you propose "maximizing ones' joy" in this life? What would you do to do this?

From my perspective and in my opinion....there is a reason the scripture quote that "men are that they might have joy" is ensconced in the chapter on opposition in the Book of Mormon...2 Nephi 2....I believe there is a difference between "joy" and being happy or having fun. Imo, true joy can only be experienced during or after experiencing it's opposite, which is generally pain, sorrow, suffering, etc.
Dove

If this is literally true then paradise could not possibly occur.

[prisonchaplain]

We will not need sorrow in paradise because our memories of sorrow in mortality will be crystal clear. The joy, peace and purpose of eternity will be so much richer for the difficulties we have already experienced. Scripture is clear--the suffering need not be eternal, but the rewards will be.

[Traveler]

First to the forum – Please everyone do not think I intend to rain on anyone parade but history is full of well-meaning dedicated to G-d individuals that have foolishly and tirelessly marched off in the wrong direction to serve G-d. During WWII at the battle of the bulge the rank and file German soldiers posted a sign facing the Allied lines that claimed “G-d is with us”.

It does seem to me that throughout history the call to serve G-d have been as destructive and an engine of human suffering as any other force the moves mankind. Currently the call of the Jihadist or terrorists is a call of total sacrifice in service to G-d.

Perhaps there are some things to consider in one’s service to G-d:

1. Don’t make a big deal of it or feel any need to announce your service to anyone.

2. Be willing not only to perform service in secret but be ashamed if you are discovered because you have, at least in part, failed if you are given thanks along with G-d.

3.. Understand the declaration of King Benjamin in the Book of Mormon “And behold, I tell you these things that ye may learn wisdom; that ye may learn that when ye are in the service of your fellow beings ye are only in the service of your God. “

4. Do not perform your service thinking that it will make you any better than anyone else.

5. Do not perform your service thinking that it will somehow reap you some additional reward or joy either here or at some future time in heaven. Do it with the understanding that the best reward is in knowing that the needed service was accomplished.

6. Be willing to apologize and take all the blame if your efforts do not work out well.

7. Finally - Be willing to scrap all your plans and accept a call to be the only person to do the clean-up after the Primary nursery class (including through-up, spilled food and dirty dippers) so everybody else can be out in the hall socializing and having fun at the end of church.

Good Luck!


The Traveler

[peteolcott]

Originally Posted by prisonchaplain

Scripture is clear--the suffering need not be eternal, but the rewards will be.

Where does it say this?

[Anddenex]

Originally Posted by Dove

Admittedly, a lot of people have considered this a "negative" and downer way for me to look at this....But, I would invite you to study all the stories of those who experienced trials and tribulation on their journey back home, in the scriptures. Don't worry, you won't have to go far to find them. Job is a great place to start....

I am not sure why anybody would consider this to be a negative outlook, when it is pretty cut and dry.

It is doctrinally true that without opposites we would not have become like God, knowing good and evil. This stands for joy and sorrow, life and death. Without the knowledge of the opposite it is literally impossible to know either. This is confirmed by 2 Nephi 2: 11 - 12, when it refers to "one body".f

One of my favorite quotes when understanding opposites said, "If you want to know what something is, then you must know what it is not." Once we understand what joy is not, its opposite, then we can more fully comprehend what it is.

How is a person able to distinguish joy or sorrow when they are "one body"? Thus, I don't see how anybody could possibly say it is a negative outlook when you are only explaining factual history within the Bible and other servants lives.

Thank you for the thoughts.

[Anddenex]

Originally Posted by peteolcott

If this is literally true then paradise could not possibly occur.

It appears you may have misinterpreted what Dove was expressing.

If what Dove said is literally true, then it is the reason why Paradise can occur. The opposite of Paradise is Spirit Prison or hell.

A person will not be fully capable of experiencing paradise unless they have knowledge of the lack of paradise. The depth at which we understand Paradise, will also allows us the understanding of its opposite. It can be said vice-versa as well, the depth at which we have comprehended hell, will also up us to understand the literal joy in Paradise.

I wish you the best in your pursuit to accept God's will, and would add, then make sure you seek the gift of Charity. The gift of Charity, is the primary element to fully accepting God's will in all we do, say, and experience. The greater our charity the greater our capacity accept God's will. Charity, the pure love of Christ, and Christ did all that God commanded and endured all that God saw fit Jesus should endure.

[prisonchaplain]

Originally Posted by peteolcott

Where does it say this?

Revelation 21:3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will adwell with them, and they shall be his people, and bGod himself shall be with them, and be their God.
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more adeath, neither bsorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more cpain: for the former things are passed away.

[Sicily510]

First and foremost I am so eternally beyond expression grateful to our Heavenly Father and the compassion he freely gives me and all of us. I am also grateful eternally beyond expression for our Savior Jesus Christ whom provided a straight and narrow path for us to be able to inherit Holiness so that we may be able to be cleansed (baptized) and worthy to stand in holy places and in the presence of the Lord thy God.

I'm very grateful for the knowledge of Jesus Christ teachings which allows me to reprove myself in his ways, and live in peace and humility. To my understanding as a member of "The Church Of Jesus Christ Of These Latter-day Saints" we are his people. For only through Jesus Christ can we enter into our Heavenly Fathers kingdom. I have never been in a church that has focused so much love and devotion to our savior Jesus Christ than this church.

I admit that I was unequal in understanding even after the fact I was baptized into this church its true divine purpose, I was like a lost sheep withering away with the wind neither knowing where I'm going to go or where I want to be. I came to a point in my life that I have only Heavenly Fathers grace and mercy to lead me back to his fold.

I believe that the prophets from the old testament to this modern day are true prophets who only teach and seek to share teachings that is of Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ. I am desirous to learn of Heavenly Father and able to discern whether the gospel is being taught with the spirit or without. For there are many who will claim to be teaching his gospels and yet may I quote "the words of the wise and their riddles. ... Dark sayings" proverb 1:6 is what becomes of it. I was given this Holy Spirit it's my inheritence to nurture and strengthen so that it may be of light for others to desire and acquire.

Mosiah 18:8-10

8 And it came to pass that he said unto them: Behold, here are the waters of Mormon (for thus were they called) and now, as ye are desirous to come into the fold of God, and to be called his people, and are willing to bear one another’s burdens, that they may be light;

9 Yea, and are willing to mourn with those that mourn; yea, and comfort those that stand in need of comfort, and to stand as witnesses of God at all times and in all things, and in all places that ye may be in, even until death, that ye may be redeemed of God, and be numbered with those of the first resurrection, that ye may have eternal life—

10 Now I say unto you, if this be the desire of your hearts, what have you against being baptized in the name of the Lord, as a witness before him that ye have entered into a covenant with him, that ye will serve him and keep his commandments, that he may pour out his Spirit more abundantly upon you?

11 And now when the people had heard these words, they clapped their hands for joy, and exclaimed: This is the desire of our hearts.

We are as to serve our Heavenly Father through charity, to help bear one anothers burdens so that they may be light, willing to mourn with those that mourn, and even comfort those that stand in need of comfort. And we must stand as "Witnesses of God at all times and in all things, and in all places that ye may be in, even until death, that ye may be redeemed of God, and be numbered with those of the first resurrection, that ye may have eternal life—"

"As we focus our energies on lifting the burdens of others, something miraculous happens. Our own burdens diminish. We become happier. There is more substance to our lives."
David S. Baxter - Oct. Gen. Conf 2006

I would like to share a song that my brother-in-law with his brothers and sisters made. It's called "Anothers Burden" by the Moleni Brothers.

Moleni Brother's - Anothers Burden - YouTube

here is the lyrics too:

Lord I will follow thee
Give all my life to thee
I would do for you
All that you ask and more
Give me strength
And help me to be strength
To those in need to bear
Anothers burden like you did for me
Chorus
Yes I am willing to mourn with those that
Mourn comfort those who stand in need of comfort
Bear anothers burden that they may be light
Oh lord help me keep you in my life
2nd verse
The road will get better along the way
But help me to trust in thee and never go astray
That I may always be a strength to those in need
Only the beginning is near, let them know that you are
Always there to guide them back to thee
Where forever one day we will be

I love all my brothers and sisters near and far, and only desire that we all may live in true happiness. That we may inherit the light of Christ and dwell in holy places with thee. I'm thankful for this forum and for the many who are seeking the light of Christ and are among these chat threads. I hope that we all may be able to help another in some way when we are seeking to teach others in Jesus Christs let us also teach in meekness exemplifying his ways. Thanks for this post I just felt the spirit to know that you are not alone in wanting to submit to the will of Heavenly Fathers, and am so grateful to know that your willing to help bear each others burdens. May you always have his spirit with you to strengthen your ability to share his love and compassion with others.