No More Prophets?

[curtishouse]

I know I'm going pretty buck wild with the questions this weekend but this is also a very important topic especially in the LDS church. The LDS church obviously believes that prophets are still around today. What do you make of these verses then?

Luke 16:16 The law and the prophets were until John: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.

Mat 11:13 For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John.

[bytebear]

The phrase "the Law and the prophets" was a common reference to the Old Testament law which was being fulfilled by Jesus Christ. The phrase or a variation of it appear 11 times in the New Testament (Matt 5:17 being the most interesting), and in context it is clear that the context is not about prophecy ending, but rather an ending to the OT law as it is fulfilled in Christ. If you think about it, how could John be the revelator, or Paul have a miraculous conversion, or Stephen have a vision of God and Christ if prophecy were to end with Christ. John in the book of Revelation specifically talks about prophets in the last days.

Amos 3:7
Surely the Lord God will do nothing, but he revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets.

[Misshalfway]

I was going to say something very similar. Maybe I will just ask .... why did Jesus call the twelve as the first order of business if he no longer wanted prophets? Why did he call Peter and give him authority? Prophets must have been important, as did the authority they possessed to act in the name of Christ when he was no longer there to lead the church.

My question for the rest of mainstream Christianity is where the heck are the 12?

[prisonchaplain]

To Curtis--this is the first I've heard of Protestant Christians saying that prophets ended with John. I'm perplexed because prophecy is one of the gifts of the Spirit detailed in the 1st letter to the Corinthians. Further, the prophet Joel declared that in the last days men and women would prophecy, and when the Holy Ghost descended on the believers on the Day of Pentecost, Peter declared, "This is that which was prophesied by Joel."

To Misshalfway...Protestant Christianity has not interpreted the New Testament in such a way as to project a hierarchical church governance with 12 apostles in perpetuity. We do carry on the Apostles' teaching, however. Now my church does have leadership that my roughly parallel the Prophet, the 12, and the 70. But, I don't believe that even the Catholic church has attempted to maintain 12 apostles.

One thought I've heard (have not researched it deeply) is that an apostle was akin to a missionary today. They started churches, and traveled to spread the Good News of the Kingdom. If so, you have 60,000 apostles. We have 1600. :-)

[Misshalfway]

I know, PC. I know. Getting another explanatory answer wasn't why I asked the question.


Curtis....And just to add something to the LDS view of prophets, you may want to look at Mosiah 8:16-18 as we think that a prophet, seer and revelator is more than just a prophet.

[BenRaines]

While in the LDS church the Apostles are those twelve called to be Prophets, Seers and Revelators, their calling also is as a "Special Witness of Christ".

Ben Raines

[Just_A_Guy]

Originally Posted by bytebear

The phrase "the Law and the prophets" was a common reference to the Old Testament law which was being fulfilled by Jesus Christ. The phrase or a variation of it appear 11 times in the New Testament (Matt 5:17 being the most interesting), and in context it is clear that the context is not about prophecy ending, but rather an ending to the OT law as it is fulfilled in Christ.

To flesh this out a bit, per Wikipedia:

The Tanakh (Hebrew: תַּנַ"ךְ‎, pronounced [taˈnax] or [təˈnax]; also Tenakh or Tenak) is a name for the Bible used in Judaism, also known as the Masoretic Text. The name "Tanakh" is a Hebrew acronym formed from the initial Hebrew letters of the Masoretic Text's three traditional subdivisions: The Torah ("Teaching", also known as the Five Books of Moses[a.k.a. "Law"--JAG]), Nevi'im ("Prophets") and Ketuvim ("Writings")—hence TaNaKh.

[curtishouse]

Originally Posted by Misshalfway

I was going to say something very similar. Maybe I will just ask .... why did Jesus call the twelve as the first order of business if he no longer wanted prophets? Why did he call Peter and give him authority? Prophets must have been important, as did the authority they possessed to act in the name of Christ when he was no longer there to lead the church.

My question for the rest of mainstream Christianity is where the heck are the 12?

My personal view is that the 12 Apostles were chosen to spread the Gospel. As shown by the greek meaning of Apostles which is:
apostolos
ap-os'-tol-os
From G649; a delegate; specifically an ambassador of the Gospel; officially a commissioner of Christ (“apostle”), (with miraculous powers): - apostle, messenger, he that is sent.

I guess this begs the question of what is the difference between an Apostle and a Prophet?

[pam]

An apostle is one that serves as a special witness of Jesus Christ.

A prophet has the same responsibilities as an apostle but the prophet is the only one that can receive revelation to guide the entire Church.

[curtishouse]

Originally Posted by prisonchaplain

To Curtis--this is the first I've heard of Protestant Christians saying that prophets ended with John.

I'm not predisposed to any one set of beliefs because I go to a Baptist church. I try to keep an open mind when it comes to doctrine. If there is Biblical backing to support a claim, I'm all for it.