The Impact of Pornography on families

[skippy740]

Originally Posted by brooklynbw

skippy740, would you marry your spouse again? According to my husband I have ruined his life. This is all my fault, and, and, and... I don't want to play games with my husband. I can't put my eternity on hold though. I did tell him that I would marry him again...if he could be porn free for awhile. When he stops saying, "I can't promise you I won't ever look again..." I'm not out looking for a new spouse. I'm not looking to replace my boys dad. I just need to be completely free of the evil that has taken over my husband. If he can get rid of it...which I believe in a Savior that has the ability to do that - I would marry him again. Is that playing games? Divorce is a big fat deal. I don't think that it is too light for what we have been through though.

Yes, I would. But there are 2 things that need fixing: me and her!

Me: I need to work on me so that I'm not doing the things that drive wedges between us.

Her: We need better communication between the two of us. She tends to "bottle" things in and not fully express her frustrations, concerns or other thoughts. She'll try to "hint" at things to get a 'clue' of how I'd react... but she doesn't talk about what's really on her mind. When we talked about serious things that I bring up... she would be "supportive on the outside" but probably harboring her own feelings and thoughts later on, resenting the previous decision.

I take responsibility for my actions. I'm still learning how my actions have affected our marriage. (In fact, I'm learning more about how my ADD has affected the marriage too.)

It was not her fault in the least. It wasn't like she wasn't pretty or wasn't good in bed. (Quite the opposite!)

Personally, I think she is taking her response too far. There are many other marriages that have survived much worse than what we've had going on. (Of course that's "comparative worthiness and feelings" instead of what she feels.) When I went to my meetings, I've heard of MUCH worse coming from the other attendees than what I have done to our marriage.

Also, her mother was divorced from a man who cheated on her. She'll say that this has nothing to do with her decision... but I think it plays a part.

Bottom line for her: she did not feel secure in the relationship.

Bottom line for me: divorce is not in my [immediate] family, nor is it part of my vocabulary.

We would definitely need a counselor-guided reconciliation.

[brooklynbw]

Skippy this is all earily familiar. My husband also has ADD and we too had a great life behind our bedroom door. In fact, that is one of the only things we had going for us. We aren't fighters so we rarely spoke unkind things to eachother but that always meant one of us was holding something back and frustration was rampant.

It breaks my heart that we couldn't figure it out. In fact, we are almost better friends apart than we were together. It is just lame. I take that back...he is still mean sometimes. I think that is just because he is angry at the situation and himself. Am I wrong? Can you tell me why you think he doesn't want to see me or the boys at all? He hasn't seen us since May and doesn't even want to come for Christmas. He is 1900 miles away... Our boys miss him and he said he would come and now he is saying that he doesn't think it is going to happen.

I feel dumb and whiney, but it is nice to talk frankly with someone instead of holding it all inside. I try to be careful about who I say things to so I don't shmear his reputation all over the place. He is a great man who made some really bad choices. So thanks for responding. Thanks for being willing to be open. Thanks for listening to me go around and around and reminding me that I didn't ruin things. Sometimes I need the Lords gentle assurances that what I'm doing isn't crazy. That I'm not the only one.

One thing that I wanted to ask is if you are going to the ARP meetings? Is your wife (or used to be wife) going too? How are you working on your addiction? What has been helpful to you? Do you still talk to her? Do you still get to see your kids?

[skippy740]

I just finished reading this book a couple of weeks ago, and I would suggest that you pick up a copy:
Amazon.com: The ADHD Effect on Marriage: Understand and Rebuild Your Relationship in Six Steps (9781886941977): Melissa C. Orlov: Books

One of the things I recognized in myself in this book... is the base, general feeling of a low estimation of myself. (I try not to use the overly used word 'self-esteem'.)

Yet, in the church, we have a VERY high sense of moral responsibility - family, church, callings, tithing, moral agency, etc.

Here's MY "guesstimation", based on how I could (and have) responded to such an invitation: seeing my (ex)wife and kids reminds me of my failures... and further cycles the feelings of inadequacy in my own life. Why would I want to be reminded of all my failures?

I see my kids about every 2 weeks. I'm unemployed and have very little resources of my own. I'm living with my parents right now... who help to make it a point that I see my kids. I'm only 20 miles away from them, so distance isn't much of an issue.

I haven't been going to the ARP meetings lately. And no, my wife hasn't ever gone to a spousal support group. In fact, just yesterday, I quoted pogi's post to her in an email along with the PDF of all the support group locations, days & times - noting that the closest spousal/family support group is in my area. (If a group was closer to her, I would suggest the closest one.) She has SAID that she wanted to go in the past... but never went. The times & days are at the same time of another calling I have (I'm an assistant cubmaster & asst Webelos Den leader). If she'll go, I'll request to be released because this would be much more important. (And no, I haven't yet gotten a response from her.)

How have I been working on my addiction? I must confess that I don't work very hard at it. I've been focusing more on the other stresses in my life and addressing the base-line mood that I'm usually in - which is more depressed than I'd care to be.

I can talk a good game... but I know I'm depressed. I've been taking some St. John's Wort to help... and I believe it has helped... which has also helped in the addiction.

How? When you feel better about life, it helps with the cravings of things that you know are missing in your life or other addictions.

One of the things that I'm discovering (for me) is the separation between my mood and my spirituality. If I'm in a depressed state of mind... does that mean that I'm unworthy of blessings? What if I'm "feeling great" but still committing sin? My spirituality is my relationship with God and the Spirit. My mood is just 'how I feel'. They are separate... at least they are to me.

So, I'm trying some appropriate supplements to help me be in the better moods that I need to be in to function in my life. It's "taking the edge off" of the cravings... but it's not a "cure-all". So St. John's Wort, Vitamin B-complex and B-12 are helping... at least it seems to.

I don't talk to her much... because I'm still trying to "fix me" and I don't want to come off as "begging" or "need for approval" from her at this time. It's just not a good way to attract someone back into your life. But I do keep in touch with her through facebook and the occasional phone call. She is busy taking nursing classes and with the custody of our three kids.

I love my kids and I want to stay involved in their lives. I think that if Chris Gardner could do it while being homeless while taking care of his 2 year old son... there is no excuse for me to spend time with the kids on some kind of regular schedule.

Pursuit of Happyness Chris Gardner Speaks part 1 - YouTube

[Vort]

skippy, my heart breaks for you. Best of luck, and I hope things go better for you.

brooklynbw,

The spouse group uses a seperate manual geared specifically toward the issues of the spouses, but still incorporates the 12 steps. Their manual, as far as I know, is not published yet so they are just using manuscripts until it is fully edited etc. In group, they all take turns reading a paragraph in the step that they are doing that week from the manuscripts. they then take turns (if you feel comfortable) sharing their experiences with that step or can share whatever is or isn't working for them, if not, you can just say pass and don't have to speak. Sometimes it is nice to just listen to what others have to share from their experiences.
If a day ever becomes available, don't let it pass. I know it may just seem like another thing to do, but you do so much for everybody else, you really should give yourself a little attention in your busy schedule.

[brooklynbw]

I looked into the book. I think I want a copy for both of us. I hadn't thought of any of this as a health problem. That sheds a whole new light on things. I don't know if my husband will believe that...he is very skeptical about everything. (He won't even have a facebook account) He has even stopped taking anything for his ADHD, depression, high blood pressure...everything. I also hadn't considered that he might be feeling like a failure and that is why he doesn't want to come see us. I just thought that he resented me in general and the thought of seeing me revulsed him. We spoke on the phone tonight as we are trying to get things separated and shipped to us since we are so far apart and I'm the one who left. He was asking about things I wanted and the topic of Christmas came up. He said (I will leave out the vulgarities...), "what good is Christmas for without family?" I don't know how to respond to him when he says things like that. What should I say to him? This whole thing is tearing me up inside and out and he thinks I'm doing it for kicks and giggles? I have no response. So now I'm home aching inside because I miss him and know he is unhappy, I'm unhappy, kids are unhappy...I hate this!

Pogi, I think I need to go to a meeting for me so that I can get on with my life...

[skippy740]

Okay, let me give you my own thoughts (and you can take it for what it's worth).

Don't try to "fix" him. He needs his own motivation and needs to feel respected as a man.

If you want to give him a copy, you can do it. Do it in a way that says: "Here's a book that I've been reading. I've been learning a lot. I thought you might like a copy too. It may help us both."

Notice that that kind of note sounds better than "Here's a book that'll help you." That sounds like trying to "fix him".

Bringing up Christmas... here's my perception based on your post: Why would he travel 1900 miles to be reminded of a life that he is no longer worthy to live? Why fake it? The internal stress and anguish is probably something he'd rather avoid - especially if he's comparing himself and the family to having a "perfect Christmas"?

Don't respond to him. He is grieving the loss of his marriage. Pretending that "everything is okay" for a few days... is probably too much.

If it were my wife trying to get me to come over for the holidays... I'd want her to tell me how helpful I could be. This would set an objective, and a purpose for being useful. I don't want to just "be there" - especially if I would feel uncomfortable being there in the first place.

Men want to be useful, so help us feel useful. We would rather have an "advisor" instead of a "nag". Point out things that are helping you and share them with him. Don't nag him to do things. Don't bring up things that "if we would've read this before, or done this before, it could've saved our marriage." Don't bring up anything that could be about new regrets.

The good thing about ADD/ADHD is that we forgive and practically forget very easily. We don't "live in the past" except to 'relive our mistakes'. Help him to adjust to your current relationship... not the relationship of the past.

That's my best insight. I hope it helps... coming from a separated ADD/ADHD man.

[skippy740]

BTW, I think, to really get insight into an ADD marriage... watch old episodes of Home Improvement. If anybody has ADD... I think Tim "the Toolman" Taylor DEFINITELY has ADD/ADHD. And it would be fun! (Keep in mind that Tim always had a job... so that made everything easier with HIS marriage/sitcom.)

[brooklynbw]

It does help skippy, that's why I keep asking...I have learned some valuable things the last few days. My mother-in-law says I don't nag and that's why my marriage is a shambles. I always figured that he was a grown up and he felt bad for the things he had said and done (or not said and not done...) and that he didn't need me to say them out loud. I think he knew when he had let us down. I didn't need to bring it up too.

I have tried to be understanding and forgiving and supportive (we've moved across country 5 times in his pursuit of growing up) I guess the hard part is that I don't have ADD/ADHD and I forgive and I try to forget, but it isn't as easy for me. After four kids (2 of which already have ADHD) it is hard to just excuse the behavior and move on.

It is hard to teach kids that "monkey see but monkey can't do too and this isnt how we treat a wife and this isn't what we do as grownups and your daddy loves you but just can't get it together..." I don't want to do that and that is the direction I am heading as my kids grow older. My ten year old whips out the "but dad does it" card all the time lately and I want to tell him things like, "look what it got him..." but I can't nor will I ever do that to him. The kids don't even know that divorce is in the mix. My husband doesn't want anyone to know much less why and I understand that and I have been trying to be respectful of that.

I have always been wary of offering him anything, much less a book because he is the kind of person that if you tell him to do something, he will do the opposite. So I appreciate the approach. I won't wrap it up as a gift either. Maybe I will even tell him about it, and then let him go after it himself.

I also think you are right on the Christmas trip. I can appreciate that, but when will he get that spark that you have about your kids (I watched the youtube)? Will he ever feel for us what we feel for him? I don't want to bring it up again. I didn't respond to his comment. I just soaked it in. It is just painful. What do I ask him to do? What kinds of things would you be willing to come and do for your family?

Enjoy conference today. I hope that there are some answers there for all of us. I know I have them stacking up in my head. I am ready. Are you?

[skippy740]

Such are the problems with an ADD marriage - raising kids without setting up double-standards and dealing with oppositional defiant disorder (and yes, I'm familiar with that one in myself too).

I wish I had advice for this... but the only thing I can think of is getting an ADD coach or marriage counselor with an emphasis in ADD. I think this will take a 3rd party to help preserve the marriage relationship "team" while transferring the "accountability" to another.

As for what I'm willing to do... I've always been willing to do whatever I could. I've always been restrained financially... even when I was employed. (Remember that I did mention reckless spending in those habits that can destroy a marriage too.) Right now, I just wish I could pay my child support as an evidence that I am willing and able to fulfill my fatherhood responsiblities. One step at a time... but patience is NOT my strong suit!

With ADD comes hyperfocus... which is great during courtship! But it transfers to another area... and for me, it transferred to building my career. I became engrossed in this... to the lack of proper and sufficient attention to my wife and children. I began to see them as interruptions and destractions to my focus... which I was trying to chase "so we can be happy".

I think the book will be a great help for you. Not everyone with ADD has the same values or priorities. If you've seen 1 person with ADD... you've seen 1 person with ADD.