Spanking

[Fiannan]

So what are people's opinions on corporal punishment (for kids)? Does anyone have any LDS Church statements on this subject?

[prisonchaplain]

So what are people's opinions on corporal punishment (for kids)? Does anyone have any LDS Church statements on this subject?
[/b]

Spanking should remain legal, and can be effective, when used rarely. In 95% of discipline situations, spanking is unnecessary, and can be counter-productive. The "spare the rod spoil the child" proverb speaks more to parents taking the time and energy to control their children, than it does specifically to wacking the child.

On the other hand, on those rare occasions when rebellion is obvious, testing is evident, and reason has failed to produce repentence or change, then the spanking can be effective. It must be done in love, not anger, in righteous discipline, not frustration.

The wise child will figure out that s/he truly has hurt the parent more than the parent has hurt him/her.

[shanstress70]

So what are people's opinions on corporal punishment (for kids)? [/b]

I think corporal punishment is wrong. However, I respect a parent's right to raise their children the way they see fit, to some extent. But we all have to do what we think is right, as long as it doesn't cross the line to abuse.

My child was a handful as soon as he could walk, and has always been a challenge. But I made a committment to not go what I feel is the easy route and spank. So far, there have been times that it was tough not to, but my child has never been spanked. And guess what? He's an extremely kind and caring child, who listens as well as any 3 yr old. Sure, he still tests me, but he knows there will be consequences of some type for any bad behavior.

IMO, spanking teaches a child that you solve things by hitting. That is the message that a child gets. They don't have the ability to think through it and reason. This is the logic they see. Guess what they are going to do when they are having a problem sharing a toy with another child?

Yes, it is more difficult and takes more creativity, but it can be done. Some techniques that we have used are time-outs (we put him in his room, although some use a chair for the child to sit it, for one minute per year); taking away favorite toys for certain behaviors; but the most effective technique of all is lots of positive comments when he makes the right choice.

This all brings me back to my other point in the first part of my post... "as long as it doesn't cross the line to abuse". There is a fine line here between spanking and abuse. Why even get close to it? Also, the times you will be spanking, you will probably be angry anyway. No one thinks too clearly when we're angry.

Also, in all the parenting books I've read, and pediatricians I've talked to, I have yet to hear the advice that you should spank your child.

[mom_of_jcchlsm]

Hubby and I disagreed on this when our oldest kids were young. He believed in spanking and I did not. We ended up spanking our oldest three kids. But found it like a drug -- it took more and more force to achieve the same effect over time. Each child responded differently, though. Our oldest learned to avoid getting in trouble (sometimes by obedience and other times by being manipulative, deceitful, or by not getting caught). Our second child was almost panicked over being spanked -- just the mention of a spanking would bring immediate submission (I always felt that was wrong). Our third child is fiercely independent and spankings became a battle ground -- he was willing to endure whatever we dished out; he just decided that most of the things he wanted to do were worth the spanking he would get for it, so he'd just do it, take the punishment, and continue on his merry way. Spanking was no deterrant, and it wasn't working as a corrective measure. By the time our fourth child was two, we had stopped spanking the older kids, so she was never really spanked. Numbers 5 and 6 have never been spanked and number 7 won't be, either.
Now, I do occasionally slap the back of a hand that is reaching for something it ought not. And I do physically remove a child from the room if needed (pick them up kicking and screaming or just hold the wrist tightly and lead them away). But the primary tools we use are positive reenforcement (praising when they do something right, occasionally giving rewards or offereing carrots) and loss of privileges (computer, phone, a particular toy, choice of clothing to wear -- whatever fits the crime or whatever affects that child the most).
It takes a lot more work to think up and enforce appropriate corrective measures than to reach out and spank the child. I think we're doing the right thing now. But raising kids is sure hard work!

[shanstress70]

Oh, one other thing that we've started doing lately that is proving to be very successful...
If I tell my child to do something (for example, go wash his hands for dinner), and he says no, I offer choices. For example, "You can either go wash your hands like a big boy right now on your own, or I can come and carry you and wash them for you." Once in a while, I end up carrying a screaming, writhing child... but most of the time he chooses the right thing because he so loves his independence! Then I pour on the praise for him making the right choice.

I've learned a lot of this by his preschool teacher. She is so awesome with kids. Her husband is a child psychologist and they have two small children, so they know all the tricks.

[mom_of_jcchlsm]

choices work great. we also explain in advance what the likely consequences of certain actions will be or ask them to tell us what they think will happen if they follow a certain course (we do this for both good and bad choices).

just this morning, my 12-yo came out wearing her older sister's shirt. Older sister is long gone (she goes straight to school from seminary). I asked "are you green to wear that shirt?" ("green" as in green light) and she said "she's let me borrow it before . . ." I simply said "You know your sister pretty well. Think things through from her point of view." 12-yo walks heads off to the bathroom to do her hair. She wore that shirt for almost a half an hour before thinking better of it. She was the last child I dropped off this morning for school. When we were alone (well, with the baby and toddler), I asked "what made you change your mind about the shirt?" She mumbled something about how that shirt kinda itches and the color is wrong. Totally ignoring her evasion, I said something like "well, I think you made a good choice. I'm thankful that I don't have to listen to you two arguing this afternoon over the shirt. Relationships are more important than things. Besides, you'll have a chance to ask her tonight if you want to borrow it tomorrow." So we'll see if she's wearing it tomorrow. Bet not (just to prove Mom wrong), but I also bet she will wear it in the near future (hopefully with permission!).

[Cal]

Spanking is wrong on several levels. First, it doesn't work. Second, it teaches one thing: When you are frustrated with the behavior of another, physical agression is appropriate. Is that really the lesson we want the child to learn? I know the first to be true, because, I tried it. Very ineffective. Bottom line: kids that get hit, learn to hit, not how to behave. Kids only learn how to behave by seeing adults they respect behave well, and by feeling secure in their relationships with those adults. Spanking is just a euphamism for physical agression or hitting. Just because the Bible condones it doesn't make it right or true. After all, the Bible also condones slavery, capital punishment and a bunch of other uncivilized behaviors.

[Palerider]

Hardly ever spanked our kids...they did know it was an option...we always looked for other ways to punish them...my wife and I discovered that when we grounded them ....that was more punishment for Mom than anyone else....we then just started taking privelages away such as.....no computer or video games or cd's and if they were driving they could not drive. They would also loose tv rights.....at first they would ask us what are suppose to do....we told them they could sit in the living room and look out the window and or read a book or magazine....this worked out good for us......just my opinion....

[Heather]

I'm a huge fan of love and logic. I never want to spank our kids. This is the points from Jim Fay (Love and Logic writer)

For the record, our present stance on spanking is:

1. There is no need for spanking.

2. Spanking is counterproductive. It makes the adult into the "bad guy" instead of the bad decision becoming the culprit.

3. Love and Logic techniques are far more powerful than spanking.

4. Most kids would much rather have a spanking than have their parents use Love and Logic techniques such as delaying the consequence while the parent thinks over the problem, develops a clear head and then locks in the empathy before telling the child what the consequence will be.

5. Since we now have such better techniques, why even consider, or waste our time with, spanking?

6. A considerable amount of solid research is now available indicating the harmful, counterproductive results of using spanking as a disciplinary tool.[/b]

[Palerider]

President Hinckley also teaches....we are suppose to Teach our kids......find his talk on that and read it....its great